Foster, Robertson etc
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@KiwiMurph Preceded/followed by announcing his resignation?
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@sparky said in Foster must go:
"Assistant Heads must roll."
If they sacrifice Cane and a couple of assistants it will be a joke. Cane is not the problem here. He's a warrior. You know what you get with him and he's delivering it - massive work ethic, strong metnal attitude, but limited game style. He's awesome, buta poor fit to the loose trio for reasons we've traversed many times.
Whitelock is a dead set legend, but an aging 33 year old who's part of a tight 5 that gets regularly dominated at the top level. He's smart, but picking him probably puts Retallick's head on the block. Honestly, it's nuts. There are no good options any more.
The curtain of silence has been ridiculous. Some of the most critical times in recent AB history and the Kremlin respond by going quiet and pulling Foster from public view. It's treating the public with derision.
@nzzp said in Foster must go:
@sparky said in Foster must go:
"Assistant Heads must roll."
If they sacrifice Cane and a couple of assistants it will be a joke. Cane is not the problem here. He's a warrior. You know what you get with him and he's delivering it - massive work ethic, strong metnal attitude, but limited game style. He's awesome, buta poor fit to the loose trio for reasons we've traversed many times.
Whitelock is a dead set legend, but an aging 33 year old who's part of a tight 5 that gets regularly dominated at the top level. He's smart, but picking him probably puts Retallick's head on the block. Honestly, it's nuts. There are no good options any more.
The curtain of silence has been ridiculous. Some of the most critical times in recent AB history and the Kremlin respond by going quiet and pulling Foster from public view. It's treating the public with derision.
To be fair, Sam Cane is a problem as captain if he doesn't command his place in the team anymore - and him getting subbed at the weekend was a bit indicative of that.
Picking Sam Whitelock through to RWC is probably sensible. He's clearly commanding his place and surely will for the next 12 months - I just hope they don't think he has to play every game.
I guess all will be revealed shortly.
My guess:
Cron taking over from Feek.
Schmidt taking over from Plumtree as 2ic with a realignment of responsibilities - not sure who becomes the forwards coach.
Doesn't seem like McLeod's role as defence coach is on the block.
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@nzzp said in Foster must go:
@sparky said in Foster must go:
"Assistant Heads must roll."
If they sacrifice Cane and a couple of assistants it will be a joke. Cane is not the problem here. He's a warrior. You know what you get with him and he's delivering it - massive work ethic, strong metnal attitude, but limited game style. He's awesome, buta poor fit to the loose trio for reasons we've traversed many times.
Whitelock is a dead set legend, but an aging 33 year old who's part of a tight 5 that gets regularly dominated at the top level. He's smart, but picking him probably puts Retallick's head on the block. Honestly, it's nuts. There are no good options any more.
The curtain of silence has been ridiculous. Some of the most critical times in recent AB history and the Kremlin respond by going quiet and pulling Foster from public view. It's treating the public with derision.
To be fair, Sam Cane is a problem as captain if he doesn't command his place in the team anymore - and him getting subbed at the weekend was a bit indicative of that.
Picking Sam Whitelock through to RWC is probably sensible. He's clearly commanding his place and surely will for the next 12 months - I just hope they don't think he has to play every game.
I guess all will be revealed shortly.
My guess:
Cron taking over from Feek.
Schmidt taking over from Plumtree as 2ic with a realignment of responsibilities - not sure who becomes the forwards coach.
Doesn't seem like McLeod's role as defence coach is on the block.
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@nzzp said in Foster must go:
@sparky said in Foster must go:
"Assistant Heads must roll."
If they sacrifice Cane and a couple of assistants it will be a joke. Cane is not the problem here. He's a warrior. You know what you get with him and he's delivering it - massive work ethic, strong metnal attitude, but limited game style. He's awesome, buta poor fit to the loose trio for reasons we've traversed many times.
Whitelock is a dead set legend, but an aging 33 year old who's part of a tight 5 that gets regularly dominated at the top level. He's smart, but picking him probably puts Retallick's head on the block. Honestly, it's nuts. There are no good options any more.
The curtain of silence has been ridiculous. Some of the most critical times in recent AB history and the Kremlin respond by going quiet and pulling Foster from public view. It's treating the public with derision.
To be fair, Sam Cane is a problem as captain if he doesn't command his place in the team anymore - and him getting subbed at the weekend was a bit indicative of that.
Picking Sam Whitelock through to RWC is probably sensible. He's clearly commanding his place and surely will for the next 12 months - I just hope they don't think he has to play every game.
I guess all will be revealed shortly.
My guess:
Cron taking over from Feek.
Schmidt taking over from Plumtree as 2ic with a realignment of responsibilities - not sure who becomes the forwards coach.
Doesn't seem like McLeod's role as defence coach is on the block.
@Chris-B said in Foster must go:
To be fair, Sam Cane is a problem as captain if he doesn't command his place in the team anymore - and him getting subbed at the weekend was a bit indicative of that.
Picking Sam Whitelock through to RWC is probably sensible. He's clearly commanding his place and surely will for the next 12 months - I just hope they don't think he has to play every game.
You realise your two sentences are dissonant, right? A captain getting hooked is a problem, but a captain you don't expect to play every game isn't?
Honestly, I'd sonner have Cane for 50-60 min, and then understnad the captaincy transfers. It's modern sport, I can live with it. Far rather that than the shambles we're going to see of dropping Cane for issues outside his control.
England used to do this didn't they with the hooker? And SA with Bismarck if I remember rightly? Hell, name some co-captains; Ardie off the bench FFS.
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@Chris-B
Assuming Schmidt takes over one of the specialist coaches jobs - he could take Moar or McLeod’s role
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@Duluth Yeah - I'm just thinking Plumtree is a strong candidate for the axe and wondering who would be forwards coach if he goes - might have to be someone new?
@Chris-B said in Foster must go:
Yeah - I'm just thinking Plumtree is a strong candidate for the axe and wondering who would be forwards coach if he goes - might have to be someone new?
Hopefully Coventry or Ryan. Either would make a huge improvement. Get that sorted and some of the other issues will disappear too
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@Chris-B said in Foster must go:
To be fair, Sam Cane is a problem as captain if he doesn't command his place in the team anymore - and him getting subbed at the weekend was a bit indicative of that.
Picking Sam Whitelock through to RWC is probably sensible. He's clearly commanding his place and surely will for the next 12 months - I just hope they don't think he has to play every game.
You realise your two sentences are dissonant, right? A captain getting hooked is a problem, but a captain you don't expect to play every game isn't?
Honestly, I'd sonner have Cane for 50-60 min, and then understnad the captaincy transfers. It's modern sport, I can live with it. Far rather that than the shambles we're going to see of dropping Cane for issues outside his control.
England used to do this didn't they with the hooker? And SA with Bismarck if I remember rightly? Hell, name some co-captains; Ardie off the bench FFS.
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@nzzp The supplementary bits are a bit - but the key points aren't.
If Cane can't command the 7 jersey he can't be captain.
@Chris-B said in Foster must go:
@nzzp The supplementary bits are a bit - but the key points aren't.
If Cane can't command the 7 jersey he can't be captain.
He'd be a standout 7 in the right trio, where strenghts are emphasised and weaknesses covered by others. Looking back, this feels a lot like the midfield leading up to 2019 - lots of players, but no clarify about our top combination.
Seriously, the issues with this team are not going to be fixed by wins in SA. They paper over the fundamental cracks. Change is needed, and Foster can't blame the supporting cast indefinitely. In the mean time, we lose two more tests to set up the right team culture and pattern.
The lack of leadership from NZR is disappointing. It appears a hot governance mess.
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@Chris-B said in Foster must go:
@nzzp The supplementary bits are a bit - but the key points aren't.
If Cane can't command the 7 jersey he can't be captain.
He'd be a standout 7 in the right trio, where strenghts are emphasised and weaknesses covered by others. Looking back, this feels a lot like the midfield leading up to 2019 - lots of players, but no clarify about our top combination.
Seriously, the issues with this team are not going to be fixed by wins in SA. They paper over the fundamental cracks. Change is needed, and Foster can't blame the supporting cast indefinitely. In the mean time, we lose two more tests to set up the right team culture and pattern.
The lack of leadership from NZR is disappointing. It appears a hot governance mess.
@nzzp I guess all will be revealed, shortly.
I don't think Cane will be dropped from the team - the question for me is whether Savea and/or Papali'i are our best 7s. In my view, Ardie probably is the best 7 - and playing him at 8 because they want him on the field is creating problems.
If I'm right about Plumtree being axed there will presumably be two new faces at the selection table and there might be more new faces in the team than I've been expecting.
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@nzzp I guess all will be revealed, shortly.
I don't think Cane will be dropped from the team - the question for me is whether Savea and/or Papali'i are our best 7s. In my view, Ardie probably is the best 7 - and playing him at 8 because they want him on the field is creating problems.
If I'm right about Plumtree being axed there will presumably be two new faces at the selection table and there might be more new faces in the team than I've been expecting.
@Chris-B said in Foster must go:
If I'm right about Plumtree being axed there will presumably be two new faces at the selection table and there might be more new faces in the team than I've been expecting.
It might be Feek as well
https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/all-blacks/129348883/dramatic-day-looms-for-nz-rugby-as-all-blacks-assistants-and-captain-sam-cane-face-axeIt is understood that Plumtree and Feek did not review favourably following the end-of-year tour in 2021, and players have again been consulted following the 2-1 home series defeat to Ireland.BUT
https://punditarena.com/rugby/eoin-harte/tadhg-furlong-greg-feek-springboks/Tadhg Furlong has praised the influence former Leinster and Ireland scrum coach Greg Feek has had on his career ahead of the Lions’ test series with the Springboks.Something doesn't add up.
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@nzzp I guess all will be revealed, shortly.
I don't think Cane will be dropped from the team - the question for me is whether Savea and/or Papali'i are our best 7s. In my view, Ardie probably is the best 7 - and playing him at 8 because they want him on the field is creating problems.
If I'm right about Plumtree being axed there will presumably be two new faces at the selection table and there might be more new faces in the team than I've been expecting.
@Chris-B said in Foster must go:
@nzzp I guess all will be revealed, shortly.
I don't think Cane will be dropped from the team - the question for me is whether Savea and/or Papali'i are our best 7s. In my view, Ardie probably is the best 7 - and playing him at 8 because they want him on the field is creating problems.
I'd happily have Ardie at 7 or on the bench;
Dalts/Cane/Ardie at 7
Sotutu/Grace at 8
ScoBa/AIoane at 6
Broadly similar players that you can slot into patterns at 6/8 that you can sub in and out. Sotutu probably adds passing and Dalts running to the repertoire.
Cane is a bloody good test player in the right trio. He has huge defensive strengths and workrate off the charts.
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@Chris-B said in Foster must go:
@nzzp I guess all will be revealed, shortly.
I don't think Cane will be dropped from the team - the question for me is whether Savea and/or Papali'i are our best 7s. In my view, Ardie probably is the best 7 - and playing him at 8 because they want him on the field is creating problems.
I'd happily have Ardie at 7 or on the bench;
Dalts/Cane/Ardie at 7
Sotutu/Grace at 8
ScoBa/AIoane at 6
Broadly similar players that you can slot into patterns at 6/8 that you can sub in and out. Sotutu probably adds passing and Dalts running to the repertoire.
Cane is a bloody good test player in the right trio. He has huge defensive strengths and workrate off the charts.
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@Chris-B said in Foster must go:
@nzzp Yeah - I don't think we have any problem with players to play at 7.
If you accept your captain can come off, and you can start Ardie on teh bench, then you have basically cracked the nut.
The issue is still in the tight 5 selections and player development. PLayers are not getting better, and I don't know why.
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I thought the scrum looked pretty good. It was everything else that was farking shithouse.
Throwing Cane and some assistants under the bus is disgusting. This whole debacle has been the Foster show and he's the one who should be getting the arse.
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I thought the scrum looked pretty good. It was everything else that was farking shithouse.
Throwing Cane and some assistants under the bus is disgusting. This whole debacle has been the Foster show and he's the one who should be getting the arse.
@Rancid-Schnitzel said in Foster must go:
Throwing Cane and some assistants under the bus is disgusting.
dont worry, they didnt...
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@Chris-B said in Foster must go:
To be fair, Sam Cane is a problem as captain if he doesn't command his place in the team anymore - and him getting subbed at the weekend was a bit indicative of that.
Picking Sam Whitelock through to RWC is probably sensible. He's clearly commanding his place and surely will for the next 12 months - I just hope they don't think he has to play every game.
You realise your two sentences are dissonant, right? A captain getting hooked is a problem, but a captain you don't expect to play every game isn't?
Honestly, I'd sonner have Cane for 50-60 min, and then understnad the captaincy transfers. It's modern sport, I can live with it. Far rather that than the shambles we're going to see of dropping Cane for issues outside his control.
England used to do this didn't they with the hooker? And SA with Bismarck if I remember rightly? Hell, name some co-captains; Ardie off the bench FFS.
@nzzp said in Foster must go:
@Chris-B said in Foster must go:
To be fair, Sam Cane is a problem as captain if he doesn't command his place in the team anymore - and him getting subbed at the weekend was a bit indicative of that.
Picking Sam Whitelock through to RWC is probably sensible. He's clearly commanding his place and surely will for the next 12 months - I just hope they don't think he has to play every game.
You realise your two sentences are dissonant, right? A captain getting hooked is a problem, but a captain you don't expect to play every game isn't?
Honestly, I'd sonner have Cane for 50-60 min, and then understnad the captaincy transfers. It's modern sport, I can live with it. Far rather that than the shambles we're going to see of dropping Cane for issues outside his control.
England used to do this didn't they with the hooker? And SA with Bismarck if I remember rightly? Hell, name some co-captains; Ardie off the bench FFS.
Yep not unusual for a captain to be hooked at, so we will see.
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@Chris-B said in Foster must go:
@nzzp Yeah - I don't think we have any problem with players to play at 7.
If you accept your captain can come off, and you can start Ardie on teh bench, then you have basically cracked the nut.
The issue is still in the tight 5 selections and player development. PLayers are not getting better, and I don't know why.
@nzzp said in Foster must go:
@Chris-B said in Foster must go:
@nzzp Yeah - I don't think we have any problem with players to play at 7.
If you accept your captain can come off, and you can start Ardie on teh bench, then you have basically cracked the nut.
The issue is still in the tight 5 selections and player development. PLayers are not getting better, and I don't know why.
Agreed. Co-captains or a vice captain.
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'I'll tell you what I am. I'm incoherent. I'm pissed'
This makes no sense at all, it's barely English
“Let me tell you who I am, I’m strong, I’m resilient, I think I’ve proven that.
“I believe I’ve got a great feel and relationship with my players. I’m strategic and I’m also accountable and I take that on board.
“I promise you, I understand that and I’m really excited about the chance to show you what this team is made of”
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'I'll tell you what I am. I'm incoherent. I'm pissed'
This makes no sense at all, it's barely English
“Let me tell you who I am, I’m strong, I’m resilient, I think I’ve proven that.
“I believe I’ve got a great feel and relationship with my players. I’m strategic and I’m also accountable and I take that on board.
“I promise you, I understand that and I’m really excited about the chance to show you what this team is made of”
@Machpants said in Foster must go:
'I'll tell you what I am. I'm incoherent. I'm pissed'
This makes no sense at all, it's barely English
“Let me tell you who I am, I’m strong, I’m resilient, I think I’ve proven that.
“I believe I’ve got a great feel and relationship with my players. I’m strategic and I’m also accountable and I take that on board.
“I promise you, I understand that and I’m really excited about the chance to show you what this team is made of”
Does he actually know the meaning of the word accountable?
