All Blacks 2024
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@gt12
I agree there were a few too many platitudes in there.I think Hansen was trying to avoid publicly calling out (what they see) as his deficiencies. (which are probably related to his defence and abrasiveness)
They did say he has been given "feedback" on his game.
@Frank said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
@gt12
I agree there were a few too many platitudes in there.I think Hansen was trying to avoid publicly calling out (what they see) as his deficiencies. (which are probably related to his defence and abrasiveness)
They did say he has been given "feedback" on his game.
And, he's got nowhere to show improvement.
Not till February next year.
NPC is such a drop in quality he could be the best player there and they won't give a fuck.
Hansen essentially said that in his interview - they don't think Super rugby stacks up against the international game. If that is the case, how is anyone going to play there way in till next year? NPC is another world.
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@Frank said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
@gt12
I agree there were a few too many platitudes in there.I think Hansen was trying to avoid publicly calling out (what they see) as his deficiencies. (which are probably related to his defence and abrasiveness)
They did say he has been given "feedback" on his game.
And, he's got nowhere to show improvement.
Not till February next year.
NPC is such a drop in quality he could be the best player there and they won't give a fuck.
Hansen essentially said that in his interview - they don't think Super rugby stacks up against the international game. If that is the case, how is anyone going to play there way in till next year? NPC is another world.
@gt12 said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
@Frank said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
@gt12
I agree there were a few too many platitudes in there.I think Hansen was trying to avoid publicly calling out (what they see) as his deficiencies. (which are probably related to his defence and abrasiveness)
They did say he has been given "feedback" on his game.
And, he's got nowhere to show improvement.
Not till February next year.
NPC is such a drop in quality he could be the best player there and they won't give a fuck.
Hansen essentially said that in his interview - they don't think Super rugby stacks up against the international game. If that is the case, how is anyone going to play there way in till next year? NPC is another world.
If they don't think SR stacks up, I guess those 7 titles don't mean shit.....
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For me the 'two cents' stats were helpful in showing that there isnt much between the three 8s when you take into account strength of the rest of the pack, systems being used, how each team chose to use their 8's , what each of the 8's natural strengths are.
You then pick an ABs 8 that fits how you want to play with consideration in the mix of the other loosies s around games.
Nothing in it for those three (but would have preferred to see the other two 8s in SR rather than jacobson (did he play 8 this season?). -
For me the 'two cents' stats were helpful in showing that there isnt much between the three 8s when you take into account strength of the rest of the pack, systems being used, how each team chose to use their 8's , what each of the 8's natural strengths are.
You then pick an ABs 8 that fits how you want to play with consideration in the mix of the other loosies s around games.
Nothing in it for those three (but would have preferred to see the other two 8s in SR rather than jacobson (did he play 8 this season?).@Lancaster-Park said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
For me the 'two cents' stats were helpful in showing that there isnt much between the three 8s when you take into account strength of the rest of the pack, systems being used, how each team chose to use their 8's , what each of the 8's natural strengths are.
You then pick an ABs 8 that fits how you want to play with consideration in the mix of the other loosies s around games.
Nothing in it for those three (but would have preferred to see the other two 8s in SR rather than jacobson (did he play 8 this season?).Jacobson started eight games at No 8 and six on the flank this year.
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A journo looks at the stats and attempts to figure out the Sotutu omission
EDIT: and ignore the click bait headline (headline editors are fluffybunnies) it is a bit more thoughtful than SOTUTU SHIT AT THIS ZOMFG
@Machpants said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
A journo looks at the stats and attempts to figure out the Sotutu omission
EDIT: and ignore the click bait headline (headline editors are fluffybunnies) it is a bit more thoughtful than SOTUTU SHIT AT THIS ZOMFG
It's a good effort, but completely fails to make allowance for how the respective Chiefs and Blues coaches wanted them to play.
The Blues front five, and Akira were brutal in carry and clean so the role of no 8 did not require as much physicality. In fact, one can argue that it made more sense for Sotutu to add his unique talents to compliment that rather than just more of the same. Notice how Kwagga Smith fed off PSDT hits?
Chiefs front five much less effective, which meant Sititi encouraged to go direct, which he did very well.
As for tackle height, I'd venture that Chiefs coaches were more onto emphasising low hits than Blues.
Where the rubber hits the road is that the Blues pack were markedly more physical than Chiefs and Blues defence was best in comp. Drawing a very long bow to contort that into indicating weakness of Sotutu in his role.
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This thread is like one of those nightmares about how the closer you get to the end, the further away you are, and you seem to keep going in circles past the same thing over and over.
Am now "only" 9 pages back.
Anyway, now we have a selection I think we can relax the restrictions on comparisons to previous tenures. I can see some definite parallels which could be explored. But keep it all seemly and don't go over the top.
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Yeah on Sotutu, to leave him put altogether suggests that they don't like him. Sure, they may think he has a few flaws in his game, but if they really wanted him, wouldn't they work on trying to iron those out whilst having him in the environment? He doesn't need to be playing down in the NPC, He's way too good for that level and will gain nothing from beating up a bunch of semi pros from Manawatu, Canterbury, Northland etc. so yeah, to me, they clearly don't like the guy, unless they want him to take out his anger out by playing for the AB XV first before calling him up later?
Either way, he should be in the squad, even if he isn't currently in their starting 23.
@African-Monkey said in All Blacks 2024 - selection:
Yeah on Sotutu, to leave him put altogether suggests that they don't like him. Sure, they may think he has a few flaws in his game, but if they really wanted him, wouldn't they work on trying to iron those out whilst having him in the environment? He doesn't need to be playing down in the NPC, He's way too good for that level and will gain nothing from beating up a bunch of semi pros from Manawatu, Canterbury, Northland etc. so yeah, to me, they clearly don't like the guy, unless they want him to take out his anger out by playing for the AB XV first before calling him up later?
Either way, he should be in the squad, even if he isn't currently in their starting 23.
Replacing whom?
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@African-Monkey said in All Blacks 2024 - selection:
Yeah on Sotutu, to leave him put altogether suggests that they don't like him. Sure, they may think he has a few flaws in his game, but if they really wanted him, wouldn't they work on trying to iron those out whilst having him in the environment? He doesn't need to be playing down in the NPC, He's way too good for that level and will gain nothing from beating up a bunch of semi pros from Manawatu, Canterbury, Northland etc. so yeah, to me, they clearly don't like the guy, unless they want him to take out his anger out by playing for the AB XV first before calling him up later?
Either way, he should be in the squad, even if he isn't currently in their starting 23.
Replacing whom?
@booboo Sititi, Jacobsen/Blackadder.
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@frugby said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
@sparky said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
@MajorRage Ardie overlooked for the captaincy, albeit for a very good candidate in Scott Barrett
Akira Ioane, nowhere to be seen, although he's signed to go to Japan.
Hoskins Sotutu not included, but given some encouraging comments by the Head Coach.
We might not like it, but questions will be asked if there's a pattern here?
The irony here. Sotutu misses out to Sititi. Ioane misses out to Finau.
The Barrett as captain has nothing to do with racism, and everything to do with being a trusted ally.
Yeah, but it can and it will be spun differently.
@sparky said in All Blacks 2024 - selection:
@frugby said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
@sparky said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
@MajorRage Ardie overlooked for the captaincy, albeit for a very good candidate in Scott Barrett
Akira Ioane, nowhere to be seen, although he's signed to go to Japan.
Hoskins Sotutu not included, but given some encouraging comments by the Head Coach.
We might not like it, but questions will be asked if there's a pattern here?
The irony here. Sotutu misses out to Sititi. Ioane misses out to Finau.
The Barrett as captain has nothing to do with racism, and everything to do with being a trusted ally.
Yeah, but it can and it will be spun differently.
So the fuck what?
The only accusation of any racial prejudice I've seen has come from YOU as a reason they didn't pick YOUR favourites. And now you're trying to say "others might spin it that way".
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From Two Cents Rugby channel.
Hoskins scored way more tries and assists and good passing.
Sotutu is also better in turnovers.
Far less tackles than the others (though Jacobson shouldn't be in there because he was 7)Aligns with the comment on his work on both sides of the ball.
I think they think he shirks the defensive work.
According to this guy Blues made marginally less tackles than the Chiefs overall in the season. Can't vouch for his numbers.Blue line is tackles per game.(Sotutu lowest)
Orange line is missed tackles (Sotutu highest)
@Frank said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
From Two Cents Rugby channel.
Hoskins scored way more tries and assists and good passing.
Sotutu is also better in turnovers.
Far less tackles than the others (though Jacobson shouldn't be in there because he was 7)Aligns with the comment on his work on both sides of the ball.
I think they think he shirks the defensive work.
According to this guy Blues made marginally less tackles than the Chiefs overall in the season. Can't vouch for his numbers.Blue line is tackles per game.(Sotutu lowest)
Orange line is missed tackles (Sotutu highest)With Blues having 70% possession on occasion, straight tackles/match comparisons are bound to be misleading.
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One thing which has been noted before, and ties in with a Two Cents speculation is that at practice, Hoss, when he's not in the 23, has poor body language. Read that when Leon dug into that he wasn't disinterested, but just a laid back bloke. Needs some mentoring (and can imagine SV being quick to tell him to get his thumb out of his Rs). Given there's not much game time at this stage, I could imagine Razor seeing that as an issue.
In contrast, Wally S will be stoked just to be holding the tackle bags when Tamaiti hits them?! -
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
@canefan said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
Scott Hansen comes across really well
Keep using him in the media please.
What did he say about Hoskins? I just missed that bit
Basically that he just needs to continue to do what he's doing - that his game is improved but he just needs to keep at it - they recognise he has points of difference to his game that other loosies don't bring. That he has been given a lot of feedback and pretty adamant that he's very close.
What he's doing, being the best 8 in the country clearly isn't working, otherwise he'd be in the team and not the young impact player from the Chiefs.
Smells a bit PR speak to me.
@Nepia said in All Blacks 2024 - selection:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
@canefan said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
Scott Hansen comes across really well
Keep using him in the media please.
What did he say about Hoskins? I just missed that bit
Basically that he just needs to continue to do what he's doing - that his game is improved but he just needs to keep at it - they recognise he has points of difference to his game that other loosies don't bring. That he has been given a lot of feedback and pretty adamant that he's very close.
What he's doing, being the best 8 in the country clearly isn't working, otherwise he'd be in the team and not the young impact player from the Chiefs.
Smells a bit PR speak to me.
He came across as a decent guy but I thought the answer to the question sounded a bit generic , because it was very similar when asked about Plummer .
We love what he’s doing , he’s just got to keep it going yada yada .
I guess shag was a one off , you can lead a horse to water but you can’t make it drink , we may not see blunt answers like that again .
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@Machpants said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
A journo looks at the stats and attempts to figure out the Sotutu omission
EDIT: and ignore the click bait headline (headline editors are fluffybunnies) it is a bit more thoughtful than SOTUTU SHIT AT THIS ZOMFG
It's a good effort, but completely fails to make allowance for how the respective Chiefs and Blues coaches wanted them to play.
The Blues front five, and Akira were brutal in carry and clean so the role of no 8 did not require as much physicality. In fact, one can argue that it made more sense for Sotutu to add his unique talents to compliment that rather than just more of the same. Notice how Kwagga Smith fed off PSDT hits?
Chiefs front five much less effective, which meant Sititi encouraged to go direct, which he did very well.
As for tackle height, I'd venture that Chiefs coaches were more onto emphasising low hits than Blues.
Where the rubber hits the road is that the Blues pack were markedly more physical than Chiefs and Blues defence was best in comp. Drawing a very long bow to contort that into indicating weakness of Sotutu in his role.
@pakman said in All Blacks 2024 - selection:
As for tackle height, I'd venture that Chiefs coaches were more onto emphasising low hits than Blues.
Interestingly it was something highlighted by Hansen, so ABs also emphasize low tackle height. They look at how the international game is reffed, much harsher than SR, and low tackling is a key part of what they want. It may be that the Blues style of choke tackling to slow the opposition down hasn't helped their case with the ABs
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Number one point here is that Nogusta pointed out that Leon MacDonald didn't back Sotutu. No wonder he failed so hard without Schmidt. Never backed his own players? Get fucked.
@Tim Yeah can't say I'm disappointed to see the back of him.
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@MajorRage Ardie overlooked for the captaincy, albeit for a very good candidate in Scott Barrett
Akira Ioane, nowhere to be seen, although he's signed to go to Japan.
Hoskins Sotutu not included, but given some encouraging comments by the Head Coach.
We might not like it, but questions will be asked if there's a pattern here?
@sparky said in All Blacks 2024 - selection:
@MajorRage Ardie overlooked for the captaincy, albeit for a very good candidate in Scott Barrett
Akira Ioane, nowhere to be seen, although he's signed to go to Japan.
Hoskins Sotutu not included, but given some encouraging comments by the Head Coach.
We might not like it, but questions will be asked if there's a pattern here?
Only if you’re an idiot.
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One thing which has been noted before, and ties in with a Two Cents speculation is that at practice, Hoss, when he's not in the 23, has poor body language. Read that when Leon dug into that he wasn't disinterested, but just a laid back bloke. Needs some mentoring (and can imagine SV being quick to tell him to get his thumb out of his Rs). Given there's not much game time at this stage, I could imagine Razor seeing that as an issue.
In contrast, Wally S will be stoked just to be holding the tackle bags when Tamaiti hits them?!We only get tiny bits of info/speculation etc so anything we might say is not said from a position of authority.
It sounds like Sotutu may need some help/support with a particular side of his work - which is off the field and also being part of a team etc and displaying the kind of attitude that helps improve his overall performance and help his team mates towards that same goal.
This should have been identified before and then supported by the right specialist in the Blues/ABs.
He doesn’t appear to have an issue in the Blues environment however.
The way he has come back from the problems of last year to be the leading player in super rugby this year should speak volumes about him as a player/person.
As I say, it is just speculation and at this stage we are making shit up about why he is not in the squad.
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It seems that Sotutu only being able to play no.8 has also counted against him. With Savea certain to start in that position versatility was important to the AB coaches.
@Bovidae Potentially, but if we have learned one thing from Jase Ryan, it is that he likes specialists... the way I see it Finau and Blackadder are the blindsides, Papalii and Jacobson (Who is probably holding the spot of Cane) are the opensides, and Savea and Sititi are the number eights.
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@sparky said in All Blacks 2024 - selection:
@MajorRage Ardie overlooked for the captaincy, albeit for a very good candidate in Scott Barrett
Akira Ioane, nowhere to be seen, although he's signed to go to Japan.
Hoskins Sotutu not included, but given some encouraging comments by the Head Coach.
We might not like it, but questions will be asked if there's a pattern here?
Only if you’re an idiot.
