All Blacks EOYT
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Hotham over Christie
@MiketheSnow said in All Blacks EOYT:
Hotham over Christie
I think the one issue is that Roigard has played no minutes so far, so you could be going into a game against Ireland with either an unproven newbie (Hotham) or a barely fit, relative newbie (Roigard) as your back-up halfback.
Neither situation is ideal. But if Roigard is able to get three or four games under his belt before the tour (which would depend on Counties getting a couple of games deep into the NPC knock-outs) and is in similar form to the beginning of the year then bringing Hotham in for Christie would make sense.
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@Canes4life said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
Would be cool to see this team vs Japan:
- Williams
- Aumua
- Tosi
- Tuipolotu
- Darry
- Blackadder
- Papali’i
- Sotutu
- Roigard/Ratima
- Plummer
- Telea
- ALB
- Proctor
- Jordan
- Love
- Bell
- Numia
- Newell
- Barrett
- Lakai
- Roigard/Ratima
- McKenzie
- Havili
Bro…..
@MN5 said in All Blacks EOYT:
@Canes4life said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
Would be cool to see this team vs Japan:
- Williams
- Aumua
- Tosi
- Tuipolotu
- Darry
- Blackadder
- Papali’i
- Sotutu
- Roigard/Ratima
- Plummer
- Telea
- ALB
- Proctor
- Jordan
- Love
- Bell
- Numia
- Newell
- Barrett
- Lakai
- Roigard/Ratima
- McKenzie
- Havili
Bro…..
Bro
- Bell
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Assuming the All Blacks follow a similar approach to 2022, I'm expecting something along the lines of the below...
All Blacks (37)
Hookers (3): Codie Taylor, Asafo Aumua, George Bell
Props (6): Ethan de Groot, Tamaiti Williams, Ofa Tu'ungafasi, Tyrel Lomax, Fletcher Newell, Pasilio Tosi
Locks (4): Scott Barrett, Tupou Vaa'i, Sam Darry, Patrick Tuipulotu
Loose forwards (7): Wallace Sititi, Dalton Papali'i, Sam Cane, Ardie Savea, Ethan Blackadder, Samipeni Finau, Luke Jacobson
Halfbacks (3): Cortez Ratima, Cam Roigard, Finlay Christie
First fives (3): Damian McKenzie, Beauden Barrett, Harry Plummer
Midifeld (5): Jordie Barrett, Anton Lienert-Brown, David Havili, Rieko Ioane, Billy Proctor
Wings (4): Caleb Clarke, Emoni Narawa, Mark Tele'a, Sevu Reece
Fullbacks (2): Will Jordan, Stephen PerofetaAll Blacks XV (28)
Hookers (2): Ricky Riccitelli, Kurt Eklund
Props (5): Xavier Numia, George Bower, Aidan Ross, Marcel Renata, Saula Ma'u
Locks (3): Josh Lord, Fabian Holland, Max Hicks
Loose forwards (6): Cullen Grace, Cameron Suafoa, Malachi Wrampling, Peter Lakai, Hugh Renton, Hoskins Sotutu
Halfbacks (2): Noah Hotham, Folau Fakatava
First fives (1): Josh Jacomb
Midfield (3): Rameka Poihipi, Quinn Tupaea, Dallas McLeod, AJ Lam
Wings (4): Gideon Wrampling, Jacob Ratumaitavuki-Kneepkens, Kini Naholo
Fullbacks (2): Ruben Love, Zarn SullivanUnavailable: Samisoni Taukei'aho
After the All Blacks XV finish their tour, I'd expect Xavier Numia, Josh Lord, Peter Lakai, Noah Hotham and Ruben Love to join the All Blacks for their final two matches against France and Italy, and likely all getting an appearance off the bench in that final game. There's not much point those guys travelling with the full squad from the get-go when they're unlikely to get minutes, and there are already guys in the full squad who are more or less just holding tackle bags each week. It's possible that some of the XV guys travel to Japan too.
Is there a massive advantage to taking Finlay Christie over Noah Hotham? Not really, but Hotham is better off getting two starts for the XV against Munster and Georgia rather than just training with the All Blacks, especially when he's already been in camp with them so he's familiar with the environment already. It's a similar story for Love and Lord.
I suspect that Razor will take Sam Cane, just because he'll be gunning for at least four wins on the tour - which means beating two out of England, Ireland and France. Cane is tailor-made for those games.
Japan will be used as a chance to give guys minutes who either a) need some game time in key positions to get up to speed ahead of the three consecutive games against England, Ireland and France (e.g. Damian McKenzie, Codie Taylor, Cam Roigard), or b) have been with the squad but haven't had the chance for many minutes (e.g. Asafo Aumua, Sam Darry, Billy Proctor).
Basically the same 23 will then be rolled out each week against England, Ireland and France - it pretty much picks itself at this stage. Italy will then be used to once again get minutes for the squad members who haven't had many opportunities yet this year, and the additional guys who come in from the All Blacks XV.
Plenty of picks in the All Blacks XV are very contestable, particularly in the loose forward and midfield (there aren't any outside centres really staking claims during the NPC that I've noticed as yet).
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@Mr-Fish
I guess Brodie McAllister will be selected ahead of Eklund.
Is Fabian Holland eligible for the All Blacks XV ?@cgrant said in All Blacks EOYT:
@Mr-Fish
I guess Brodie McAllister will be selected ahead of Eklund.
Is Fabian Holland eligible for the All Blacks XV ?I think McAlister is a better player, to be fair, provided he's injury free.
It's up to NZR whether Holland is eligible or not. There are no wider rules from WR preventing his selection because the XV isn't a designated capture team.
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@MiketheSnow said in All Blacks EOYT:
Hotham over Christie
I think the one issue is that Roigard has played no minutes so far, so you could be going into a game against Ireland with either an unproven newbie (Hotham) or a barely fit, relative newbie (Roigard) as your back-up halfback.
Neither situation is ideal. But if Roigard is able to get three or four games under his belt before the tour (which would depend on Counties getting a couple of games deep into the NPC knock-outs) and is in similar form to the beginning of the year then bringing Hotham in for Christie would make sense.
@Mr-Fish said in All Blacks EOYT:
@MiketheSnow said in All Blacks EOYT:
Hotham over Christie
I think the one issue is that Roigard has played no minutes so far, so you could be going into a game against Ireland with either an unproven newbie (Hotham) or a barely fit, relative newbie (Roigard) as your back-up halfback.
Neither situation is ideal. But if Roigard is able to get three or four games under his belt before the tour (which would depend on Counties getting a couple of games deep into the NPC knock-outs) and is in similar form to the beginning of the year then bringing Hotham in for Christie would make sense.
Roigard has to start in Japan and ideally Hotham get some time too. Ironically, 9 is an area which is looking good, but we need to give the tyros experience quickly. If experience colours Robertson's selections, TJP over Christie...
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@Mr-Fish said in All Blacks EOYT:
@MiketheSnow said in All Blacks EOYT:
Hotham over Christie
I think the one issue is that Roigard has played no minutes so far, so you could be going into a game against Ireland with either an unproven newbie (Hotham) or a barely fit, relative newbie (Roigard) as your back-up halfback.
Neither situation is ideal. But if Roigard is able to get three or four games under his belt before the tour (which would depend on Counties getting a couple of games deep into the NPC knock-outs) and is in similar form to the beginning of the year then bringing Hotham in for Christie would make sense.
Roigard has to start in Japan and ideally Hotham get some time too. Ironically, 9 is an area which is looking good, but we need to give the tyros experience quickly. If experience colours Robertson's selections, TJP over Christie...
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks EOYT:
@Mr-Fish said in All Blacks EOYT:
@MiketheSnow said in All Blacks EOYT:
Hotham over Christie
I think the one issue is that Roigard has played no minutes so far, so you could be going into a game against Ireland with either an unproven newbie (Hotham) or a barely fit, relative newbie (Roigard) as your back-up halfback.
Neither situation is ideal. But if Roigard is able to get three or four games under his belt before the tour (which would depend on Counties getting a couple of games deep into the NPC knock-outs) and is in similar form to the beginning of the year then bringing Hotham in for Christie would make sense.
Roigard has to start in Japan and ideally Hotham get some time too. Ironically, 9 is an area which is looking good, but we need to give the tyros experience quickly. If experience colours Robertson's selections, TJP over Christie...
So Ratima might not play any top level rugby between now and starting against England?
There's a chance he gets a game for Waikato in the NPC finals but no guarantees.
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@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks EOYT:
@Mr-Fish said in All Blacks EOYT:
@MiketheSnow said in All Blacks EOYT:
Hotham over Christie
I think the one issue is that Roigard has played no minutes so far, so you could be going into a game against Ireland with either an unproven newbie (Hotham) or a barely fit, relative newbie (Roigard) as your back-up halfback.
Neither situation is ideal. But if Roigard is able to get three or four games under his belt before the tour (which would depend on Counties getting a couple of games deep into the NPC knock-outs) and is in similar form to the beginning of the year then bringing Hotham in for Christie would make sense.
Roigard has to start in Japan and ideally Hotham get some time too. Ironically, 9 is an area which is looking good, but we need to give the tyros experience quickly. If experience colours Robertson's selections, TJP over Christie...
So Ratima might not play any top level rugby between now and starting against England?
There's a chance he gets a game for Waikato in the NPC finals but no guarantees.
@Mr-Fish said in All Blacks EOYT:
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks EOYT:
@Mr-Fish said in All Blacks EOYT:
@MiketheSnow said in All Blacks EOYT:
Hotham over Christie
I think the one issue is that Roigard has played no minutes so far, so you could be going into a game against Ireland with either an unproven newbie (Hotham) or a barely fit, relative newbie (Roigard) as your back-up halfback.
Neither situation is ideal. But if Roigard is able to get three or four games under his belt before the tour (which would depend on Counties getting a couple of games deep into the NPC knock-outs) and is in similar form to the beginning of the year then bringing Hotham in for Christie would make sense.
Roigard has to start in Japan and ideally Hotham get some time too. Ironically, 9 is an area which is looking good, but we need to give the tyros experience quickly. If experience colours Robertson's selections, TJP over Christie...
So Ratima might not play any top level rugby between now and starting against England?
There's a chance he gets a game for Waikato in the NPC finals but no guarantees.
Aye, it's a real balancing act but Ratima has had more Test minutes recently. Or maybe use him as 1st choice and ease Roigard in from the bench?
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Darry deserves a start against Japan . He was playing as well as Vaai
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If Proctor doesn't start against Japan I'll eat my hat
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If Proctor doesn't start against Japan I'll eat my hat
@BerniesCorner said in All Blacks EOYT:
If Proctor doesn't start against Japan I'll eat my hat
If he does I reckon not to be seen again until something like Tonga next year.
But get some hat seasoning.
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Questions:
Did BB play well??? he had a large influence on the game and seemed in the pocket more with Jordan at FB, we didn't start as well but finished better with Dmac coming on. Could we develop that on the tour?@BorderJB said in All Blacks EOYT:
Questions:
Did BB play well??? he had a large influence on the game and seemed in the pocket more with Jordan at FB, we didn't start as well but finished better with Dmac coming on. Could we develop that on the tour?I like the sound of developing a fullback at fullback.
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@BorderJB said in All Blacks EOYT:
Questions:
Did BB play well??? he had a large influence on the game and seemed in the pocket more with Jordan at FB, we didn't start as well but finished better with Dmac coming on. Could we develop that on the tour?I like the sound of developing a fullback at fullback.
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@DaGrubster said in All Blacks EOYT:
@Jet said in All Blacks EOYT:
Squad needs freshening up.
Id be looking at Lakai, Sotutu, Hotham, an outside back, and maybe another bolter or two.
Agreed, get rid of Cane, TJP, rest Savea
Lakai for Cane, Sotutu for one of Jacobsen, Finau, Paps or Blackadder. Hotham for TJ, with Roigard getting 3rd spot.
Then maybe a Narawa or Kneepkens or Zarn for a bit of zest.
@Jet said in All Blacks EOYT:
@DaGrubster said in All Blacks EOYT:
@Jet said in All Blacks EOYT:
Squad needs freshening up.
Id be looking at Lakai, Sotutu, Hotham, an outside back, and maybe another bolter or two.
Agreed, get rid of Cane, TJP, rest Savea
Lakai for Cane, Sotutu for one of Jacobsen, Finau, Paps or Blackadder. Hotham for TJ, with Roigard getting 3rd spot.
Then maybe a Narawa or Kneepkens or Zarn for a bit of zest.
Is Hotham not already in?
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What isn't Paps getting more game time
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Assuming the All Blacks follow a similar approach to 2022, I'm expecting something along the lines of the below...
All Blacks (37)
Hookers (3): Codie Taylor, Asafo Aumua, George Bell
Props (6): Ethan de Groot, Tamaiti Williams, Ofa Tu'ungafasi, Tyrel Lomax, Fletcher Newell, Pasilio Tosi
Locks (4): Scott Barrett, Tupou Vaa'i, Sam Darry, Patrick Tuipulotu
Loose forwards (7): Wallace Sititi, Dalton Papali'i, Sam Cane, Ardie Savea, Ethan Blackadder, Samipeni Finau, Luke Jacobson
Halfbacks (3): Cortez Ratima, Cam Roigard, Finlay Christie
First fives (3): Damian McKenzie, Beauden Barrett, Harry Plummer
Midifeld (5): Jordie Barrett, Anton Lienert-Brown, David Havili, Rieko Ioane, Billy Proctor
Wings (4): Caleb Clarke, Emoni Narawa, Mark Tele'a, Sevu Reece
Fullbacks (2): Will Jordan, Stephen PerofetaAll Blacks XV (28)
Hookers (2): Ricky Riccitelli, Kurt Eklund
Props (5): Xavier Numia, George Bower, Aidan Ross, Marcel Renata, Saula Ma'u
Locks (3): Josh Lord, Fabian Holland, Max Hicks
Loose forwards (6): Cullen Grace, Cameron Suafoa, Malachi Wrampling, Peter Lakai, Hugh Renton, Hoskins Sotutu
Halfbacks (2): Noah Hotham, Folau Fakatava
First fives (1): Josh Jacomb
Midfield (3): Rameka Poihipi, Quinn Tupaea, Dallas McLeod, AJ Lam
Wings (4): Gideon Wrampling, Jacob Ratumaitavuki-Kneepkens, Kini Naholo
Fullbacks (2): Ruben Love, Zarn SullivanUnavailable: Samisoni Taukei'aho
After the All Blacks XV finish their tour, I'd expect Xavier Numia, Josh Lord, Peter Lakai, Noah Hotham and Ruben Love to join the All Blacks for their final two matches against France and Italy, and likely all getting an appearance off the bench in that final game. There's not much point those guys travelling with the full squad from the get-go when they're unlikely to get minutes, and there are already guys in the full squad who are more or less just holding tackle bags each week. It's possible that some of the XV guys travel to Japan too.
Is there a massive advantage to taking Finlay Christie over Noah Hotham? Not really, but Hotham is better off getting two starts for the XV against Munster and Georgia rather than just training with the All Blacks, especially when he's already been in camp with them so he's familiar with the environment already. It's a similar story for Love and Lord.
I suspect that Razor will take Sam Cane, just because he'll be gunning for at least four wins on the tour - which means beating two out of England, Ireland and France. Cane is tailor-made for those games.
Japan will be used as a chance to give guys minutes who either a) need some game time in key positions to get up to speed ahead of the three consecutive games against England, Ireland and France (e.g. Damian McKenzie, Codie Taylor, Cam Roigard), or b) have been with the squad but haven't had the chance for many minutes (e.g. Asafo Aumua, Sam Darry, Billy Proctor).
Basically the same 23 will then be rolled out each week against England, Ireland and France - it pretty much picks itself at this stage. Italy will then be used to once again get minutes for the squad members who haven't had many opportunities yet this year, and the additional guys who come in from the All Blacks XV.
Plenty of picks in the All Blacks XV are very contestable, particularly in the loose forward and midfield (there aren't any outside centres really staking claims during the NPC that I've noticed as yet).
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Do we know what size the eoyt squad will be? I’m guessing a little more than rugby championship squad
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@Jet said in All Blacks EOYT:
@DaGrubster said in All Blacks EOYT:
@Jet said in All Blacks EOYT:
Squad needs freshening up.
Id be looking at Lakai, Sotutu, Hotham, an outside back, and maybe another bolter or two.
Agreed, get rid of Cane, TJP, rest Savea
Lakai for Cane, Sotutu for one of Jacobsen, Finau, Paps or Blackadder. Hotham for TJ, with Roigard getting 3rd spot.
Then maybe a Narawa or Kneepkens or Zarn for a bit of zest.
Is Hotham not already in?
@pakman said in All Blacks EOYT:
@Jet said in All Blacks EOYT:
@DaGrubster said in All Blacks EOYT:
@Jet said in All Blacks EOYT:
Squad needs freshening up.
Id be looking at Lakai, Sotutu, Hotham, an outside back, and maybe another bolter or two.
Agreed, get rid of Cane, TJP, rest Savea
Lakai for Cane, Sotutu for one of Jacobsen, Finau, Paps or Blackadder. Hotham for TJ, with Roigard getting 3rd spot.
Then maybe a Narawa or Kneepkens or Zarn for a bit of zest.
Is Hotham not already in?
As in retains his place instead of TJP with a view to being used. With Roigard easing back into test rugby against Italy.
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@pakman said in All Blacks EOYT:
@Jet said in All Blacks EOYT:
@DaGrubster said in All Blacks EOYT:
@Jet said in All Blacks EOYT:
Squad needs freshening up.
Id be looking at Lakai, Sotutu, Hotham, an outside back, and maybe another bolter or two.
Agreed, get rid of Cane, TJP, rest Savea
Lakai for Cane, Sotutu for one of Jacobsen, Finau, Paps or Blackadder. Hotham for TJ, with Roigard getting 3rd spot.
Then maybe a Narawa or Kneepkens or Zarn for a bit of zest.
Is Hotham not already in?
As in retains his place instead of TJP with a view to being used. With Roigard easing back into test rugby against Italy.
@Jet said in All Blacks EOYT:
@pakman said in All Blacks EOYT:
@Jet said in All Blacks EOYT:
@DaGrubster said in All Blacks EOYT:
@Jet said in All Blacks EOYT:
Squad needs freshening up.
Id be looking at Lakai, Sotutu, Hotham, an outside back, and maybe another bolter or two.
Agreed, get rid of Cane, TJP, rest Savea
Lakai for Cane, Sotutu for one of Jacobsen, Finau, Paps or Blackadder. Hotham for TJ, with Roigard getting 3rd spot.
Then maybe a Narawa or Kneepkens or Zarn for a bit of zest.
Is Hotham not already in?
As in retains his place instead of TJP with a view to being used. With Roigard easing back into test rugby against Italy.
The performances of Ratima and Hotham give us the luxury of not rushing Cam back. If they take TJP at Hotham's expense I could see that though
