2025 All Blacks v France series
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I think NZ could get away with a 6:2 split on the bench given the flexibility of guys like McKenzie/Barrett/Barrett/Love and Ioane/Tavatavanawai, but I don't think Love should be the starting 10 at this stage. Would like to see him get some game time there during the season and seeing if he can push McKenzie for the starting role, but at this point in time McKenzie is very clearly the best operator at 10.
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@Mauss I think the corner has been turned for Will Jordan and we started to see in the latter part of the test season when he was consistently selected at fullback and then into this super season.
It would be a retrograde step to not have him start at fullback for the all the key games this season.
@ACT-Crusader said in 2025 All Blacks Squad v France:
@Mauss I think the corner has been turned for Will Jordan and we started to see in the latter part of the test season when he was consistently selected at fullback and then into this super season.
It would be a retrograde step to not have him start at fullback for the all the key games this season.
I agree that Jordan has improved a lot at fullback this season and he would be a more than adequate Test 15. I also think he's better at the back than on the right wing. My thinking is more around bench impact and using the 6/2-split.
One area where the ABs came up consistently short against both South Africa and France was the bench. The issue was, in my view, not so much the quality of the bench players, as the lack of tactical variation that the changes brought. And while this "cohesion approach" worked well against teams like Ireland – another side which prefers tactical consistency for 80 minutes – it doesn’t work nearly as well against sides like South Africa and France, who use their bench to not just freshen up their forwards but to introduce important tactical shifts as well.
So, for me, pragmatism needs to be key against these two teams, where the bench is used as a way to switch up the way the side plays in the second half. Switching players like McKenzie and Jordan around – while also introducing completely different types of players like Finau and Tavatavanawai into the fold early in the second half – would allow the side to play in a tactically varied manner.
South Africa and France use their bench to completely freshen up their forward pack, not just having 7 extra forwards on there but also often employing a system of rolling subs (for example, Mauvaka coming back on for Boudehent last November). We also saw that the NZ attack became much less effective as the game wore on, due to both fatigue as well as predictability. Robertson, in other words, needs to find a way to switch up his attack in the 2nd half. A Test match against France and South Africa has basically evolved into two games. So, in my view, you need two game plans to combat these sides.
Switching players around – not unlike the Chiefs did this year with Jacomb, Stevenson and McKenzie – is a relatively straightforward way to do this.
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We need speed on the wings, and soon.
It stretches the field and the opposition centre has to worry about helping his outside, and the opposition wing has to worry about being gassed.
Even if they themselves dont touch the ball, they create doubt and space inside for others.
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@sparky said in 2025 All Blacks Squad v France:
@antipodean Finau will feature in the series for sure, but not necessarily at 6 in Test One.
What position do you think he'd play instead? He's a blindside flanker who would only move to lock in an emergency.
It's unfathomable that a blindside flanker (the only genuine one in the squad) would make way for a player out of position in the first Test if he's fit.
Finau will be 6 or on the bench. But I don't think it's guaranteed he's the first-choice 6 in the squad they've selected.
There are lots of players around the world who play Test Rugby in one position and for international Rugby in another.
I'm not saying it's right or wrong, but given how much this coaching group are praising Fabian Holland I can see him starting the first test at lock and then one of Scott Barrett or Tupou Vaa'i being played at 6.
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We need speed on the wings, and soon.
It stretches the field and the opposition centre has to worry about helping his outside, and the opposition wing has to worry about being gassed.
Even if they themselves dont touch the ball, they create doubt and space inside for others.
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Blues best player (AJ Lam) is the most unlucky. With LF probably coming in for the RC, I guess he won't be selected this year.
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Overall reflections on the squad
Front Row - Those are the best choices available.
Lock - Again, those are the best choices available, but it worries me a bit that Robertson was talking about Vaii as a 6 and it worries me a lot that he was talking about Scott Barrett as a 6.
Back row - None of those are bad options, but I think Dalton Papalii has been hard done by and, with Scott Parker unavailable, I'd have picked Ah Khoi or Beehre (probably Beehre) as a 6.
Half Back - No complaints. Those are the best three.
First Five - Reihana's not far away and feels more of a pick for the future than Beauden Barrett, but Robertson likes those two for his game plan.
Midfield - Feels like they picked one too many and if you were picking that many then AJ Lam should have been given a chance.
Wing - I'm worried about our shortage of pace. I'd have taken a chance on Leroy Carter, if Caleb Tangitau wasn't going to be ready.
Full Back - Fine, those are the best two.
So, yeah, overall, it's a good squad, better than the one this time last year, but the balance of the back row selections ain't right, we are going to lack pace out wide relative to the French and two or three Blues have been hard done by.
I think we'll win the series against France 2-1.
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Overall reflections on the squad
Front Row - Those are the best choices available.
Lock - Again, those are the best choices available, but it worries me a bit that Robertson was talking about Vaii as a 6 and it worries me a lot that he was talking about Scott Barrett as a 6.
Back row - None of those are bad options, but I think Dalton Papalii has been hard done by and, with Scott Parker unavailable, I'd have picked Ah Khoi or Beehre (probably Beehre) as a 6.
Half Back - No complaints. Those are the best three.
First Five - Reihana's not far away and feels more of a pick for the future than Beauden Barrett, but Robertson likes those two for his game plan.
Midfield - Feels like they picked one too many and if you were picking that many then AJ Lam should have been given a chance.
Wing - I'm worried about our shortage of pace. I'd have taken a chance on Leroy Carter, if Caleb Tangitau wasn't going to be ready.
Full Back - Fine, those are the best two.
So, yeah, overall, it's a good squad, better than the one this time last year, but the balance of the back row selections ain't right, we are going to lack pace out wide relative to the French and two or three Blues have been hard done by.
I think we'll win the series against France 2-1.
@sparky said in 2025 All Blacks Squad v France:
Leroy Carter
I don't think he's exactly express pace. I'd be mildly surprised if he's faster than Clarke or Love.
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@sparky said in 2025 All Blacks Squad v France:
Leroy Carter
I don't think he's exactly express pace. I'd be mildly surprised if he's faster than Clarke or Love.
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@Bones Hard to know. He's not prime Joe Rokocoko fast, but I'd have thought he was slightly quicker than those two.
Basically I want more pace out wide, but I'm not sure who?
@sparky said in 2025 All Blacks Squad v France:
@Bones Hard to know. He's not prime Joe Rokocoko fast, but I'd have thought he was slightly quicker than those two.
Basically I want more pace out wide, but I'm not sure who?
Id play Jordan on the wing, he has looked great there in the past, and have Love at 15. Tangitau when fit. That would provide 2 pacey wings and Love to hopefully help put them in space.
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@sparky said in 2025 All Blacks Squad v France:
@Bones Hard to know. He's not prime Joe Rokocoko fast, but I'd have thought he was slightly quicker than those two.
Basically I want more pace out wide, but I'm not sure who?
Id play Jordan on the wing, he has looked great there in the past, and have Love at 15. Tangitau when fit. That would provide 2 pacey wings and Love to hopefully help put them in space.
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Overall reflections on the squad
Front Row - Those are the best choices available.
Lock - Again, those are the best choices available, but it worries me a bit that Robertson was talking about Vaii as a 6 and it worries me a lot that he was talking about Scott Barrett as a 6.
Back row - None of those are bad options, but I think Dalton Papalii has been hard done by and, with Scott Parker unavailable, I'd have picked Ah Khoi or Beehre (probably Beehre) as a 6.
Half Back - No complaints. Those are the best three.
First Five - Reihana's not far away and feels more of a pick for the future than Beauden Barrett, but Robertson likes those two for his game plan.
Midfield - Feels like they picked one too many and if you were picking that many then AJ Lam should have been given a chance.
Wing - I'm worried about our shortage of pace. I'd have taken a chance on Leroy Carter, if Caleb Tangitau wasn't going to be ready.
Full Back - Fine, those are the best two.
So, yeah, overall, it's a good squad, better than the one this time last year, but the balance of the back row selections ain't right, we are going to lack pace out wide relative to the French and two or three Blues have been hard done by.
I think we'll win the series against France 2-1.
@sparky said in 2025 All Blacks Squad v France:
Overall reflections on the squad
Front Row - Those are the best choices available.
Lock - Again, those are the best choices available, but it worries me a bit that Robertson was talking about Vaii as a 6 and it worries me a lot that he was talking about Scott Barrett as a 6.
Back row - None of those are bad options, but I think Dalton Papalii has been hard done by and, with Scott Parker unavailable, I'd have picked Ah Khoi or Beehre (probably Beehre) as a 6.
Half Back - No complaints. Those are the best three.
First Five - Reihana's not far away and feels more of a pick for the future than Beauden Barrett, but Robertson likes those two for his game plan.
Midfield - Feels like they picked one too many and if you were picking that many then AJ Lam should have been given a chance.
Wing - I'm worried about our shortage of pace. I'd have taken a chance on Leroy Carter, if Caleb Tangitau wasn't going to be ready.
Full Back - Fine, those are the best two.
So, yeah, overall, it's a good squad, better than the one this time last year, but the balance of the back row selections ain't right, we are going to lack pace out wide relative to the French and two or three Blues have been hard done by.
I think we'll win the series against France 2-1.
The squad will either be much better or much more frustrating come the Rugby Championship... Potentially one of TK Howden or Simon Parker, and one of Caleb Tangitau or even JRK. Alternatively, Blackadder, Havili and Fihaki could come in - but Razor has earned little bit of respite from the criticism given the squad he's named does seem to at least be heading in the right direction.
I'd be surprised if France win a game. I think it'll be very similar to the 2012 Ireland tour - a decent win, a narrow win and a massive win.
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There's a lot of talk of Vaai at 6, has Robertson actually specified him, or just that they're looking at using a lock there?
Not sure I like Finau off the bench, don't recall that working great.
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Been travelling, so only just looked at the squad.
It's radically conservative if that makes sense. Hasn't made any off-the-wall selections but has clearly moved on from last year, dropped some players, made some changes based on form and picked players who'll fit his game plan.
So pretty pleased with the selection - solid mix of proven and new. Just hope he gives the new guys plenty of game time.
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Loved the interview with Blackadder on the news. Seemed upbeat and said with a smile on his face that missing out on the ABs is life and he'll crack on. Almost want him to have an injury free run and get back into the side, love that positivity. Havili, however seemed a little downcast at not making it.
@Canes4life said in 2025 All Blacks Squad v France:
Havili, however seemed a little downcast at not making it.
I'm actually surprised that he isn't in the squad. He's been outstanding in SR, particularly in the latter stages. For me it's a good sign Robertson want's to kick on.
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No Blackadder and havilli is still a shock to me even if it was tipped .
Maybe it’s time for us to let the theory of the razor crusader bias go
@kiwiinmelb said in 2025 All Blacks Squad v France:
No Blackadder and havilli is still a shock to me even if it was tipped .
Maybe it’s time for us to let the theory of the razor crusader bias go
Never believed that. Natural he went for current AB's he knew well in his first year.
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@Canes4life said in 2025 All Blacks Squad v France:
Havili, however seemed a little downcast at not making it.
I'm actually surprised that he isn't in the squad. He's been outstanding in SR, particularly in the latter stages. For me it's a good sign Robertson want's to kick on.
@Victor-Meldrew said in 2025 All Blacks Squad v France:
@Canes4life said in 2025 All Blacks Squad v France:
Havili, however seemed a little downcast at not making it.
I'm actually surprised that he isn't in the squad. He's been outstanding in SR, particularly in the latter stages. For me it's a good sign Robertson want's to kick on.
Yup. He was a lynchpin for the Crusaders, providing quiet leadership, solid D, big boot. He was a great source of assurance for the young 10s playing inside him and stepping in to first receiver as and when needed.
I think he was voted the Crusader man of the year by the club.
