The Silver Fern

@pakman said in All Blacks 2025:

https://www.rugbypass.com/news/scott-robertson-discusses-his-future-leading-the-all-blacks/

Worst head coach since John Mitchell.

This is as good as it's going to get. He'll continue to "Super-Rugby-ifying" the team will small, ineffective loosies. Get an over the hill RM back at ten, the very average/error prone LF at centre, Jordan at fullback instead of the wing and we'll all have tight schincters worrying about losing the Bledisloe or the Eden Park record with a wildly inconsistent AB team. Slow march towards becoming the Wales of the South Pacific.

Any team that fronts up with a tough forward pack will destory us.

@MajorPom said in Wales v All Blacks:

@Kirwan disagree on the cricket. Actually think they have that pretty good It’s a slow game so doesn’t kill it.

NRL bunker has it spot on for 80-90 min matches.

I jumped onto the ashes and died of boredom watching them look for what felt like an hour looking for a sound rolling the tape forward and back.

Was painful.

@MajorPom said in Wales v All Blacks:

@Mr-Fish said in Wales v All Blacks:

@Bones said in Wales v All Blacks:

@Mr-Fish held up before grounding is in no way the same as a knock on. The ball is grounded, that's all there is to it.

I agree with you, the ball isn't held up for long enough and it should be play on. But my point was that the TMO wasn't disputing that the ball was eventually grounded, he was saying that it was held up first. It wasn't a case that it looked held up from one angle but grounded from another.

When the referee says “I have a clear grounding”, that should be it, over.

Puts his feet up and sends a selfie to his missus saying something like “easiest job ever”. The modern TMO is the literal definition of a solution looking for a problem.

And I fucking hate those fluffybunnies.

I'm at the same point with rugby and cricket. Umpires/Refs making mistakes is part of the sport. Best is the enemy of good.

Get rid of TMOs completely.

LF makes way too many mistakes to be in the All Blacks. Scrapes in on the wing maybe, but there are better options there too.

Misses tackles, awful ball security, the wingers just wouldn't get the ball - which apparantly is RI's big problem yet look how quick the wingers got the ball in the weekend.

The ones that are correct are bad enough to ignore the AI hallucinations.

Have to shake you head at LLMs at times.

@Gunner said in New All Black Coach:

Robertson isn’t going anywhere, NZ Rugby doesn’t fire coaches.

No they just undermine them and play footsy with the new hotness under the table.

I’m finding it hilarious that after all shit thrown at Foster to get Robertson the job, he’s been shown to be a much better Test coach than baldy.

I don’t double check AI.

Just try not to think about all the software being written without checking as well

@ShaquilleOatmeal said in Razor's Firsts:

@Kirwan They’d only need to win by nine or more this weekend to be better than the worst year since professional rugby - 1998, an especially bad year results-wise. I might check back after the weekend and see whatever else sticks out in those stats.

I have the chungus Grok, so any stats analysis you want just shout out.

@reprobate said in All Blacks 2025:

@taniwharugby said in All Blacks 2025:

@reprobate seeing him and BB flounder this year makes you wonder if both have just been given free reign to do what they want and play what see, rather than a plan that everyone plays.

Yeah, it's hard to know.

With BB, in many ways he plays the same in every team. He has always kicked the ball away a lot on attack: chipped for himself, cross kicks etc. They are high risk / high reward, 'I'm gonna be the hero', plays. Personally I hate that shit: keep the ball and be clinical and ruthless. For me, if there is a difference in his play, it would be that he looks to be under instructions to put up a lot of contestable high kicks, and he's just not accurate enough, more often than not they are too deep and just a straight turnover. When you combine those two things, it's not pretty.

With Savea, he can play different roles in different teams / at different times. The loosies are super confused to me, but if he's getting 'just do your thing' as his instructions, that would go a long way to explaining it. To be fair, Lakai at least did have a clear role against the Poms; however, he's just not big enough, nor was he given the ball in good enough situations for him doing most of our carrying to be a great idea.

Are Savea's multiple roles "Chip kick from the 22" and "Don't pass to unmarked players in an overlap"? Or just "Don't clean at a ruck, get ready for another run instead".

@ShaquilleOatmeal said in Razor's Firsts:

If you're prepared to do the work and add in this year's efforts, I found some stuff here yesterday: https://www.rugbyhistory.co.nz/historical-results

For example, by my calculations, and with a game to fix it to some extent, this year's average points difference per game is the worst since 1976, currently sitting at 4.59.

Asking Grok is not much work.

"Under Scott Robertson's 2025 campaign (12 Tests played as of November 21, 2025: 9 wins, 3 losses), the All Blacks' average net points difference per game (NZ score minus opponent score) currently sits at 4.58 (rounded to 4.59 in some calculations, depending on exact rounding). This accounts for all completed matches, including the three losses where the difference is negative.

Using the historical results from the provided link (https://www.rugbyhistory.co.nz/historical-results, which points to a PDF of All Blacks Test results from 1959–2024), I cross-checked the average net points difference for each year from 1976 to 2024. No year from 1977 to 2024 has an average of 4.59 or lower—1976 had an average of 3.67 across 6 Tests (2 wins, 4 losses), but every subsequent year averaged higher (e.g., 1977: 12.25; 2024: 10.71).

Therefore, yes, 2025's current average is the worst since 1976, though tomorrow's final Test vs. Wales could improve it slightly if the All Blacks win by a decent margin."

Unlikely to be maintained with after Wales result bar a complete disaster or a close win.

@brodean said in New All Black Coach:

Tony Brown is kinda unavailable since he is coaching the Boks attack.

Well, the AB Coaching jobs are not available either. Not the point of the thread.

This is wishing for competent coaches, and who'd we prefer over the medicority we are currently having to endure.

@nzzp said in New All Black Coach:

There's a bunch of coaches I'd see in there, in reasonably any combo

Joe Schmidt for instance, with anyone
Rennie and Joseph
etc

not a major @Kirwan

I'd need tech support (@Duluth) to add new items, so just add those in the replies

@antipodean said in Razor's Firsts:

@Kirwan said in Razor's Firsts:

Lowest points tally in a single Rugby Championship campaign for the All Blacks
2024: 16 points, the worst ever. This undercuts the previous lows of 20 points (2015 and 2019).

Worth noting those were RWC years, so an abridged version.

True, so the 16 in a non-WC year is worse than it looks.

@nzzp said in New All Black Coach:

Should have allowed multiple options.

Like?

Foster had his own thread for this (here), seems only fair to have one for the messiah.

Heaviest defeat in All Blacks history
Lost 43–10 to South Africa in Wellington (33-point margin). This is the largest margin of defeat ever for New Zealand in, surpassing previous highs like the 35-point loss to South Africa in 1921 or the 28-point loss to Australia in 2003.

First-ever loss to Argentina on Argentine soil
Lost 29–23 to Argentina in Buenos Aires. Prior to this, the All Blacks were unbeaten in 18 Tests in Argentina (dating back to 1985), with all previous losses to the Pumas occurring on New Zealand soil (e.g., 2022 and 2024 in Christchurch and Wellington).

First back-to-back losses to Argentina in All Blacks history
Following the 38–30 home loss to Argentina on August 10, 2024 (in Wellington), the 29–23 defeat in Buenos Aires on August 23, 2025, marked the first time New Zealand lost consecutive Tests to the Pumas.

Lowest win percentage after first 14 Tests for any All Blacks coach in the professional era
At the end of 2024 (14 Tests: 10 wins, 4 losses), Robertson's 71.4% win rate was the weakest start since 1996—worse than predecessors like Ian Foster (78.6%), Steve Hansen (92.9%), and Graham Henry (85.7%).

Most losses in the first 19 Tests for any All Blacks coach since the 1970s
As of mid-September 2025 (after the South Africa loss), Robertson had 6 losses—tied for the most in a coach's opening 19 games since Laurie Mains (1992–1995). This climbed to 7 after the England defeat, exceeding any coach's tally in that span during the professional era.

And just some Rugby Championship highlights;

First consecutive non-winning finishes in the Rugby Championship for the All Blacks
2024 (2nd) and 2025 (2nd), marking the first time New Zealand has failed to win the title in back-to-back years since the tournament began in 2012. All prior non-1st finishes (2015: 2nd; 2019: 3rd) were isolated

Lowest points tally in a single Rugby Championship campaign for the All Blacks
2024: 16 points, the worst ever. This undercuts the previous lows of 20 points (2015 and 2019).

Most losses in a single Rugby Championship campaign for the All Blacks
2024: 3 losses (to Argentina at home, and South Africa twice away), the highest ever in the tournament's history (since 2012). Previous highs were 2 losses (e.g., 2015, 2019).

@Yeetyaah said in New All Black Coach:

Mark Hammet and Warren Gatland please.

I was going to put a joke option in there, but that's covered by the current coaches.

@canefan said in New All Black Coach:

Clearly you put Hansen in there for a laugh?

For the Cantabs.

Assuming the NZR grow a spine and hold the current coaches accountable for two years of poor results, who would you like to replace them?

To keep the options down, I just did pairs. Anybody missing?

@voodoo said in All Blacks 2025:

@antipodean said in All Blacks 2025:

@Old-Alleynians said in All Blacks 2025:

@Victor-Meldrew

I am told after Taylor's 100th in Argentina - only the Crusaders players in the squad went to his room to drink with him. I cannot say who the source is so take it as you will.

If true, this all comes back to the original squad and Razor taking a giant shit on the form players of SR and instead bringing in the grossly undeserving.

So much for his vaunted man management and motivational skills.

Really?

Firstly, I can't see how this story is true - or if it is, it would have been a super select invite list at Taylors doing, just a couple of close mates, likely spur of the moment or something.

I just can't see the non-Cantab players hating Razor so much that they refuse the chance to honour a bloke like Taylor who has been an awesome AB and seems very well-liked by all.

We all like to hate on Ardie for his game, but can you imagine him saying to Codie "cheers for the invite bro, but fuck that, Razor sucks, I'm not coming"? DMac? Sami?

Just nah

Maybe the Crusaders have a clique, and it's not just Razor? CEO, Coaches, Captain...

@reprobate said in All Blacks 2025:

@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2025:

@canefan said in All Blacks 2025:

If you give a guy work ons and he does these, then you fail to pick him anyway, what message does that send? Could he take you at your word, or would he start to feel that he was being lied to and that you actually had no intention to give him another chance?

if you've ever worked on the door of a bar or club, this is the "sorry mate, not in those shoes" tactic. Look, we both know you're blind, but this is less likely to result in an argument and quite possibly a fight.

It is. Hoskins went and put in all the effort to go home and get some fucking great shoes too. That'd fuck me right off.

And regularly outplayed the guy picked ahead of him, once in a Super Rugby final.