All Blacks 2025
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@Chris-B said in All Blacks 2025:
So a question.
If you assume that Scooter is going to be picked because he's the captain.
If all of our locks are fit - who else gets to play?
Vaa'i, Tuipolotu, Holland, Lord, Darry
You've summed up the issues with this AB team.
Form doesn't matter if you are one of those who can't be touched. -
So a question.
If you assume that Scooter is going to be picked because he's the captain.
If all of our locks are fit - who else gets to play?
Vaa'i, Tuipolotu, Holland, Lord, Darry
@Chris-B said in All Blacks 2025:
So a question.
If you assume that Scooter is going to be picked because he's the captain.
If all of our locks are fit - who else gets to play?
Vaa'i, Tuipolotu, Holland, Lord, Darry
Form wise, I'd probably plump for PT and FH, but very tough on Va'ai - I'm not averse to seeing more of him at 6. Lord and Darry can bide their time, pretty tough on Darry too.
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@Chris-B said in All Blacks 2025:
So a question.
If you assume that Scooter is going to be picked because he's the captain.
If all of our locks are fit - who else gets to play?
Vaa'i, Tuipolotu, Holland, Lord, Darry
Form wise, I'd probably plump for PT and FH, but very tough on Va'ai - I'm not averse to seeing more of him at 6. Lord and Darry can bide their time, pretty tough on Darry too.
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@Chris-B said in All Blacks 2025:
@Bones Holland or Patty on the bench?
Specialist bench man PT. Holland is a starter only for me and I'd probably still keep PT on the bench if Holland was out.
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@gt12 Well, it's not often the captain gets dumped - you have to go back to about 1989.
And it's a boring question if you allow Scott to be dumped, since a fair proportion of non-Crusaders fans will advocate for it.
@Chris-B said in All Blacks 2025:
@gt12 Well, it's not often the captain gets dumped - you have to go back to about 1989.
And it's a boring question if you allow Scott to be dumped, since a fair proportion of non-Crusaders fans will advocate for it.
Why not be innovative and have him as the team captain? That doesn't mean he starts every game. Put Codie Taylor at captain when Scott's form isn't good enough.
Here's the issue: As you are explaining it, they should avoid the hard calls because no one has done it for 30 odd years.
And, non Cantab supporters may argue for it, because on form there would little reason for Scott to be thrown back to the starting job if everyone was fit.
But, they aren't - Pat T and Vaaii are out.
So, for this week, it wouldn't be a surprise to see Lord moved back to the bench, and Barrett back in alongside Holland. Darry could be a smokey for a bench role, but that seems hard on Lord.
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@Chris-B said in All Blacks 2025:
@gt12 Well, it's not often the captain gets dumped - you have to go back to about 1989.
And it's a boring question if you allow Scott to be dumped, since a fair proportion of non-Crusaders fans will advocate for it.
Why not be innovative and have him as the team captain? That doesn't mean he starts every game. Put Codie Taylor at captain when Scott's form isn't good enough.
Here's the issue: As you are explaining it, they should avoid the hard calls because no one has done it for 30 odd years.
And, non Cantab supporters may argue for it, because on form there would little reason for Scott to be thrown back to the starting job if everyone was fit.
But, they aren't - Pat T and Vaaii are out.
So, for this week, it wouldn't be a surprise to see Lord moved back to the bench, and Barrett back in alongside Holland. Darry could be a smokey for a bench role, but that seems hard on Lord.
@gt12 said in All Blacks 2025:
@Chris-B said in All Blacks 2025:
@gt12 Well, it's not often the captain gets dumped - you have to go back to about 1989.
And it's a boring question if you allow Scott to be dumped, since a fair proportion of non-Crusaders fans will advocate for it.
Why not be innovative and have him as the team captain? That doesn't mean he starts every game. Put Codie Taylor at captain when Scott's form isn't good enough.
Here's the issue: As you are explaining it, they should avoid the hard calls because no one has done it for 30 odd years.
And, non Cantab supporters may argue for it, because on form there would little reason for Scott to be thrown back to the starting job if everyone was fit.
But, they aren't - Pat T and Vaaii are out.
So, for this week, it wouldn't be a surprise to see Lord moved back to the bench, and Barrett back in alongside Holland. Darry could be a smokey for a bench role, but that seems hard on Lord.
Not sure the captaincy can work that way.
Don't know what job you do - but, imagine if your CEO came in and said - your manager's been a bit shit lately, so we're going to send him off to be the filing clerk for a few months and you're in charge.
A couple of months later - he looks like he's recaptured his form. Right - you guys are all back to your old jobs and he's back giving the orders.
I think he's got to be gone - as I think Taine and Reuben were when new regimes came in.
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@gt12 said in All Blacks 2025:
@Chris-B said in All Blacks 2025:
@gt12 Well, it's not often the captain gets dumped - you have to go back to about 1989.
And it's a boring question if you allow Scott to be dumped, since a fair proportion of non-Crusaders fans will advocate for it.
Why not be innovative and have him as the team captain? That doesn't mean he starts every game. Put Codie Taylor at captain when Scott's form isn't good enough.
Here's the issue: As you are explaining it, they should avoid the hard calls because no one has done it for 30 odd years.
And, non Cantab supporters may argue for it, because on form there would little reason for Scott to be thrown back to the starting job if everyone was fit.
But, they aren't - Pat T and Vaaii are out.
So, for this week, it wouldn't be a surprise to see Lord moved back to the bench, and Barrett back in alongside Holland. Darry could be a smokey for a bench role, but that seems hard on Lord.
Not sure the captaincy can work that way.
Don't know what job you do - but, imagine if your CEO came in and said - your manager's been a bit shit lately, so we're going to send him off to be the filing clerk for a few months and you're in charge.
A couple of months later - he looks like he's recaptured his form. Right - you guys are all back to your old jobs and he's back giving the orders.
I think he's got to be gone - as I think Taine and Reuben were when new regimes came in.
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@Chris-B because captaining a rugby team is just like having an office job?
I've seen it before, maybe not so often in rugby but it's not uncommon in other sports.
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If SB can recapture his form, then he and Holland with PT on the bench is seriously strong. If he can't recapture that form, then they will need to look for a new captain after the tour. Trouble is, there aren't many obvious options to take over. People have vouched for Ardie, but his decision making is not crash hot, twice he has attempted chip kicks from our own 22 at awful times in the match.
I think we have a couple of future AB captains in Roigard and Sititi, but Sititi got the 2nd season blues (which he is now overcoming), and it'd be too much to put on Roigard's plate right now given his inexperience how dependent we already are on him.
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@gt12 said in All Blacks 2025:
@Chris-B said in All Blacks 2025:
@gt12 Well, it's not often the captain gets dumped - you have to go back to about 1989.
And it's a boring question if you allow Scott to be dumped, since a fair proportion of non-Crusaders fans will advocate for it.
Why not be innovative and have him as the team captain? That doesn't mean he starts every game. Put Codie Taylor at captain when Scott's form isn't good enough.
Here's the issue: As you are explaining it, they should avoid the hard calls because no one has done it for 30 odd years.
And, non Cantab supporters may argue for it, because on form there would little reason for Scott to be thrown back to the starting job if everyone was fit.
But, they aren't - Pat T and Vaaii are out.
So, for this week, it wouldn't be a surprise to see Lord moved back to the bench, and Barrett back in alongside Holland. Darry could be a smokey for a bench role, but that seems hard on Lord.
Not sure the captaincy can work that way.
Don't know what job you do - but, imagine if your CEO came in and said - your manager's been a bit shit lately, so we're going to send him off to be the filing clerk for a few months and you're in charge.
A couple of months later - he looks like he's recaptured his form. Right - you guys are all back to your old jobs and he's back giving the orders.
I think he's got to be gone - as I think Taine and Reuben were when new regimes came in.
@Chris-B said in All Blacks 2025:
@gt12 said in All Blacks 2025:
@Chris-B said in All Blacks 2025:
@gt12 Well, it's not often the captain gets dumped - you have to go back to about 1989.
And it's a boring question if you allow Scott to be dumped, since a fair proportion of non-Crusaders fans will advocate for it.
Why not be innovative and have him as the team captain? That doesn't mean he starts every game. Put Codie Taylor at captain when Scott's form isn't good enough.
Here's the issue: As you are explaining it, they should avoid the hard calls because no one has done it for 30 odd years.
And, non Cantab supporters may argue for it, because on form there would little reason for Scott to be thrown back to the starting job if everyone was fit.
But, they aren't - Pat T and Vaaii are out.
So, for this week, it wouldn't be a surprise to see Lord moved back to the bench, and Barrett back in alongside Holland. Darry could be a smokey for a bench role, but that seems hard on Lord.
Not sure the captaincy can work that way.
Don't know what job you do - but, imagine if your CEO came in and said - your manager's been a bit shit lately, so we're going to send him off to be the filing clerk for a few months and you're in charge.
A couple of months later - he looks like he's recaptured his form. Right - you guys are all back to your old jobs and he's back giving the orders.
I think he's got to be gone - as I think Taine and Reuben were when new regimes came in.
Chiefs did it well, but I'm not actually suggesting it. The point though is that he may not be able to hold his spot as the captain with the way these younger guys are playing. I hope that the coaches are open enough next year to consider benching him - we can't carry our captain, they have to secure their spot on merit alone.
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@Chris-B said in All Blacks 2025:
@gt12 said in All Blacks 2025:
@Chris-B said in All Blacks 2025:
@gt12 Well, it's not often the captain gets dumped - you have to go back to about 1989.
And it's a boring question if you allow Scott to be dumped, since a fair proportion of non-Crusaders fans will advocate for it.
Why not be innovative and have him as the team captain? That doesn't mean he starts every game. Put Codie Taylor at captain when Scott's form isn't good enough.
Here's the issue: As you are explaining it, they should avoid the hard calls because no one has done it for 30 odd years.
And, non Cantab supporters may argue for it, because on form there would little reason for Scott to be thrown back to the starting job if everyone was fit.
But, they aren't - Pat T and Vaaii are out.
So, for this week, it wouldn't be a surprise to see Lord moved back to the bench, and Barrett back in alongside Holland. Darry could be a smokey for a bench role, but that seems hard on Lord.
Not sure the captaincy can work that way.
Don't know what job you do - but, imagine if your CEO came in and said - your manager's been a bit shit lately, so we're going to send him off to be the filing clerk for a few months and you're in charge.
A couple of months later - he looks like he's recaptured his form. Right - you guys are all back to your old jobs and he's back giving the orders.
I think he's got to be gone - as I think Taine and Reuben were when new regimes came in.
Chiefs did it well, but I'm not actually suggesting it. The point though is that he may not be able to hold his spot as the captain with the way these younger guys are playing. I hope that the coaches are open enough next year to consider benching him - we can't carry our captain, they have to secure their spot on merit alone.
@gt12 I do go back to Steve Hansen's mantra - that experience is important.
It's not everything - but, Steve finally went away from it in 2019 and I reckon it cost him.
Can't carry people forever waiting for them to recapture form, but there's no reason Scott can't get back to his best and he's shown signs at time this year.
I'd be keeping the faith for now and I'm sure they will.
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@gt12 I do go back to Steve Hansen's mantra - that experience is important.
It's not everything - but, Steve finally went away from it in 2019 and I reckon it cost him.
Can't carry people forever waiting for them to recapture form, but there's no reason Scott can't get back to his best and he's shown signs at time this year.
I'd be keeping the faith for now and I'm sure they will.
@Chris-B
Ok Razor.
Pat T has 58 fucking tests, he's been an AB for 11 fucking years.
Vaa'ii has 45 fucking tests, he's not a newbie.
Holland will have more than 30 tests by the time we get to the WC.Experience is not the be all and end all.
Samuel Whitelock debuted in 2010 and started the WC final the following year. -
@gt12 Well, it's not often the captain gets dumped - you have to go back to about 1989.
And it's a boring question if you allow Scott to be dumped, since a fair proportion of non-Crusaders fans will advocate for it.
@Chris-B said in All Blacks 2025:
@gt12 Well, it's not often the captain gets dumped - you have to go back to about 1989.
And it's a boring question if you allow Scott to be dumped, since a fair proportion of non-Crusaders fans will advocate for it.
Aren't there any Crusaders fans who don't prefer Scott B as captain/automatic lock pick?
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If SB can recapture his form, then he and Holland with PT on the bench is seriously strong. If he can't recapture that form, then they will need to look for a new captain after the tour. Trouble is, there aren't many obvious options to take over. People have vouched for Ardie, but his decision making is not crash hot, twice he has attempted chip kicks from our own 22 at awful times in the match.
I think we have a couple of future AB captains in Roigard and Sititi, but Sititi got the 2nd season blues (which he is now overcoming), and it'd be too much to put on Roigard's plate right now given his inexperience how dependent we already are on him.
@No-Quarter said in All Blacks 2025:
If SB can recapture his form, then he and Holland with PT on the bench is seriously strong. If he can't recapture that form, then they will need to look for a new captain after the tour. Trouble is, there aren't many obvious options to take over. People have vouched for Ardie, but his decision making is not crash hot, twice he has attempted chip kicks from our own 22 at awful times in the match.
I think we have a couple of future AB captains in Roigard and Sititi, but Sititi got the 2nd season blues (which he is now overcoming), and it'd be too much to put on Roigard's plate right now given his inexperience how dependent we already are on him.
agree with this.
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@gt12 I do go back to Steve Hansen's mantra - that experience is important.
It's not everything - but, Steve finally went away from it in 2019 and I reckon it cost him.
Can't carry people forever waiting for them to recapture form, but there's no reason Scott can't get back to his best and he's shown signs at time this year.
I'd be keeping the faith for now and I'm sure they will.
@Chris-B said in All Blacks 2025:
I'd be keeping the faith for now and I'm sure they will.
Yes I think they are loyal to him and they'll reckon he'll come right.
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@Chris-B said in All Blacks 2025:
@gt12 Well, it's not often the captain gets dumped - you have to go back to about 1989.
And it's a boring question if you allow Scott to be dumped, since a fair proportion of non-Crusaders fans will advocate for it.
Aren't there any Crusaders fans who don't prefer Scott B as captain/automatic lock pick?
@nostrildamus said in All Blacks 2025:
@Chris-B said in All Blacks 2025:
@gt12 Well, it's not often the captain gets dumped - you have to go back to about 1989.
And it's a boring question if you allow Scott to be dumped, since a fair proportion of non-Crusaders fans will advocate for it.
Aren't there any Crusaders fans who don't prefer Scott B as captain/automatic lock pick?
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@nostrildamus said in All Blacks 2025:
@Chris-B said in All Blacks 2025:
@gt12 Well, it's not often the captain gets dumped - you have to go back to about 1989.
And it's a boring question if you allow Scott to be dumped, since a fair proportion of non-Crusaders fans will advocate for it.
Aren't there any Crusaders fans who don't prefer Scott B as captain/automatic lock pick?
@Snowy said in All Blacks 2025:
@nostrildamus said in All Blacks 2025:
@Chris-B said in All Blacks 2025:
@gt12 Well, it's not often the captain gets dumped - you have to go back to about 1989.
And it's a boring question if you allow Scott to be dumped, since a fair proportion of non-Crusaders fans will advocate for it.
Aren't there any Crusaders fans who don't prefer Scott B as captain/automatic lock pick?
That's probably because there are bugger all of us on here.
For what it's worth, I think being captain has harmed his game. And captaincy doesn't seem a natural fit for him.
