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AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?

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  • NepiaN Nepia

    @Crucial said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

    @shark said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

    @sparky said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

    @shark said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

    @sparky Ioane only burst onto the scene 3-4 years ago. He must be in his mid-20s. Yet you speak of him like he's 30 years plus and/or coming back from a knee injury.

    He is 23. Played Centre at School/Under 20. Started pro-Rugby on the Wing. Was oustanding in 2017. Had some calf/hamstring problems in 2018 and 2019. Now says he prefers 13. Looking good there.

    Thanks for the player bio. How about explaining how or why he's no longer fast enough to play wing, in your opinion?

    I'd guarantee he's quicker than Ben Smith was the last few years, quicker than CJ at his peak etc etc.

    I have a suspicion that speed is not the reason at all.
    No one will admit this type of flaw publicly but I suspect that if you analysed his natural play on the wing you can also work out how to shut him down easily. It could be a body position thing or a one way step or an initial movement.
    Good defensive coaches pour over tapes to find these flaws and neutralise good players.
    Those same attributes may not show up when playing without the sideline as a defender or when taking the ball on running lines.
    Just a possibility

    TBH, sounds like bollocks, most super coaches couldn't shut him down last year even when he had a niggle and he was barely given any ball at international level for the theory to be tested there.

    TimT Offline
    TimT Offline
    Tim
    wrote on last edited by Tim
    #995

    @Nepia Also see the two tries he scored while playing 11, before getting injured, in the first round game against the Chiefs this year.

    1 Reply Last reply
    2
    • CrucialC Crucial

      @shark said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

      @sparky said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

      @shark said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

      @sparky Ioane only burst onto the scene 3-4 years ago. He must be in his mid-20s. Yet you speak of him like he's 30 years plus and/or coming back from a knee injury.

      He is 23. Played Centre at School/Under 20. Started pro-Rugby on the Wing. Was oustanding in 2017. Had some calf/hamstring problems in 2018 and 2019. Now says he prefers 13. Looking good there.

      Thanks for the player bio. How about explaining how or why he's no longer fast enough to play wing, in your opinion?

      I'd guarantee he's quicker than Ben Smith was the last few years, quicker than CJ at his peak etc etc.

      I have a suspicion that speed is not the reason at all.
      No one will admit this type of flaw publicly but I suspect that if you analysed his natural play on the wing you can also work out how to shut him down easily. It could be a body position thing or a one way step or an initial movement.
      Good defensive coaches pour over tapes to find these flaws and neutralise good players.
      Those same attributes may not show up when playing without the sideline as a defender or when taking the ball on running lines.
      Just a possibility

      BonesB Offline
      BonesB Offline
      Bones
      wrote on last edited by
      #996

      @Crucial said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

      Good defensive coaches pour over tapes to find these flaws and neutralise good players.

      No.

      Billy TellB taniwharugbyT 2 Replies Last reply
      0
      • BonesB Bones

        @Crucial said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

        Good defensive coaches pour over tapes to find these flaws and neutralise good players.

        No.

        Billy TellB Offline
        Billy TellB Offline
        Billy Tell
        wrote on last edited by Billy Tell
        #997

        @Bones said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

        @Crucial said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

        Good defensive coaches pour over tapes to find these flaws and neutralise good players.

        No.

        That’s a pore error.

        CrucialC MN5M 2 Replies Last reply
        3
        • BonesB Bones

          @Crucial said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

          Good defensive coaches pour over tapes to find these flaws and neutralise good players.

          No.

          taniwharugbyT Offline
          taniwharugbyT Offline
          taniwharugby
          wrote on last edited by
          #998

          @Bones they may pour something over them after they are done to stop them falling into the wrong hands?

          1 Reply Last reply
          1
          • SnowyS Snowy

            @sparky said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

            @taniwharugby I guess, but for previous tours for a very long time there have always been confirmed fixtures before the squad's named.

            This is not like previous years. The biggest winner of the 2020 year is the word "unprecedented".

            We are still able to have an All Blacks squad.

            No QuarterN Offline
            No QuarterN Offline
            No Quarter
            wrote on last edited by
            #999

            @Snowy said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

            @sparky said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

            @taniwharugby I guess, but for previous tours for a very long time there have always been confirmed fixtures before the squad's named.

            This is not like previous years. The biggest winner of the 2020 year is the word "unprecedented".

            We are still able to have an All Blacks squad.

            I'd like to see them name a team on Thursday as well regardless of whether there is a game on.

            1 Reply Last reply
            2
            • Billy TellB Billy Tell

              @Bones said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

              @Crucial said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

              Good defensive coaches pour over tapes to find these flaws and neutralise good players.

              No.

              That’s a pore error.

              CrucialC Offline
              CrucialC Offline
              Crucial
              wrote on last edited by
              #1000

              @Billy-Tell said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

              @Bones said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

              @Crucial said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

              Good defensive coaches pour over tapes to find these flaws and neutralise good players.

              No.

              That’s a pore error.

              I was time poor

              1 Reply Last reply
              1
              • Billy TellB Billy Tell

                @Bones said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

                @Crucial said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

                Good defensive coaches pour over tapes to find these flaws and neutralise good players.

                No.

                That’s a pore error.

                MN5M Online
                MN5M Online
                MN5
                wrote on last edited by MN5
                #1001

                @Billy-Tell said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

                @Bones said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

                @Crucial said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

                Good defensive coaches pour over tapes to find these flaws and neutralise good players.

                No.

                That’s a pore error.

                Dog goes into an old western bar and says......

                ‘I’m looking for the man who shot my pore’

                1 Reply Last reply
                0
                • CrucialC Crucial

                  @DMX said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

                  @sparky said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

                  Sparky's 23 to take on Whoever:

                  Moody, Taylor, Laulala, Whitelock, Tuipulotu, Frizell, Cane (c), Sotutu, A. Smith, Mo'unga, C. Clarke, ALB, R. Ioane, Jordan, J. Barrett

                  Coles, Hodgman, Ofa T, Strange or Grace, A. Savea, TJP, B. Barrett, Goodhue

                  Nothing really screams Fozzie about this squad, I am still of the opinion he will be very conservative with first match
                  Moody, Taylor, Laulala, Whitelock, Tuipulotu, Frizell, Cane (c), Savea, A. Smith, Mo'unga, Bridge, ALB, Goodhue, Reece, B. Barrett
                  Coles, Hodgman, Ofa , Strange. Sotutu, TJP, J. Barrett, R. Iaone

                  New blood will be introduced via the bench or through injury as usual.
                  The locks will rotate on the pine and I can see Savea playing cover while the likes of Sotutu are given a start.
                  Lomax and Hodgman will get some bench roles too.
                  The starting changes should be ditching Bridge and Reece (who have been fizzers IMO) and establishing Clarke and Jordan.

                  J Offline
                  J Offline
                  junior
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #1002

                  @Crucial said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

                  @DMX said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

                  @sparky said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

                  Sparky's 23 to take on Whoever:

                  Moody, Taylor, Laulala, Whitelock, Tuipulotu, Frizell, Cane (c), Sotutu, A. Smith, Mo'unga, C. Clarke, ALB, R. Ioane, Jordan, J. Barrett

                  Coles, Hodgman, Ofa T, Strange or Grace, A. Savea, TJP, B. Barrett, Goodhue

                  Nothing really screams Fozzie about this squad, I am still of the opinion he will be very conservative with first match
                  Moody, Taylor, Laulala, Whitelock, Tuipulotu, Frizell, Cane (c), Savea, A. Smith, Mo'unga, Bridge, ALB, Goodhue, Reece, B. Barrett
                  Coles, Hodgman, Ofa , Strange. Sotutu, TJP, J. Barrett, R. Iaone

                  New blood will be introduced via the bench or through injury as usual.
                  The locks will rotate on the pine and I can see Savea playing cover while the likes of Sotutu are given a start.
                  Lomax and Hodgman will get some bench roles too.
                  The starting changes should be ditching Bridge and Reece (who have been fizzers IMO) and establishing Clarke and Jordan.

                  First, I hope this is the case, but based on Plum's comments yesterday I think they'll start conservatively with Ardie at 8 and then look to bring in Hoskins after that (maybe in test 2, 3 or 4 depending upon how Ardie goes). To my mind, a lot depends upon how Frizell / Akira go at 6. If they're not doing the business then we may be forced to play Ardie there, which leaves us no choice but to throw Hoskins in.

                  Second, couldn't agree more. Clarke and Jordan could not have been more dynamic the other day when compared to what we've had to our up with Reece and Carthorse Mark II.

                  StargazerS 1 Reply Last reply
                  1
                  • NepiaN Nepia

                    @MN5 said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

                    @Gunner said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

                    @nzzp @Crucial Bridge = Ralph v 2.0

                    I'll be pissed if they go with the safe boring option. Clarke should be the starter every day of the week ending in a y.

                    Well seeing as tests are often on a Satdee or a Sundee I can see them going with Bridge on occasions.

                    So he'll get the odd Bledisloe but nothing else.

                    My preferred back three are Barrett (the good one), Rieko and Clarke, with Goodhue and ALB in the midfield.

                    J Offline
                    J Offline
                    junior
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #1003

                    @Nepia said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

                    @MN5 said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

                    @Gunner said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

                    @nzzp @Crucial Bridge = Ralph v 2.0

                    I'll be pissed if they go with the safe boring option. Clarke should be the starter every day of the week ending in a y.

                    Well seeing as tests are often on a Satdee or a Sundee I can see them going with Bridge on occasions.

                    So he'll get the odd Bledisloe but nothing else.

                    My preferred back three are Barrett (the good one), Rieko and Clarke, with Goodhue and ALB in the midfield.

                    How's that going to happen - Clarke and Rieko both play left wing?

                    NepiaN KiwiMurphK 2 Replies Last reply
                    0
                    • J junior

                      @Nepia said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

                      @MN5 said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

                      @Gunner said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

                      @nzzp @Crucial Bridge = Ralph v 2.0

                      I'll be pissed if they go with the safe boring option. Clarke should be the starter every day of the week ending in a y.

                      Well seeing as tests are often on a Satdee or a Sundee I can see them going with Bridge on occasions.

                      So he'll get the odd Bledisloe but nothing else.

                      My preferred back three are Barrett (the good one), Rieko and Clarke, with Goodhue and ALB in the midfield.

                      How's that going to happen - Clarke and Rieko both play left wing?

                      NepiaN Online
                      NepiaN Online
                      Nepia
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #1004

                      @junior said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

                      @Nepia said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

                      @MN5 said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

                      @Gunner said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

                      @nzzp @Crucial Bridge = Ralph v 2.0

                      I'll be pissed if they go with the safe boring option. Clarke should be the starter every day of the week ending in a y.

                      Well seeing as tests are often on a Satdee or a Sundee I can see them going with Bridge on occasions.

                      So he'll get the odd Bledisloe but nothing else.

                      My preferred back three are Barrett (the good one), Rieko and Clarke, with Goodhue and ALB in the midfield.

                      How's that going to happen - Clarke and Rieko both play left wing?

                      I didn't know there was a rule that wings are only ever allowed to play one side. 😉

                      J 1 Reply Last reply
                      1
                      • J junior

                        @Nepia said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

                        @MN5 said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

                        @Gunner said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

                        @nzzp @Crucial Bridge = Ralph v 2.0

                        I'll be pissed if they go with the safe boring option. Clarke should be the starter every day of the week ending in a y.

                        Well seeing as tests are often on a Satdee or a Sundee I can see them going with Bridge on occasions.

                        So he'll get the odd Bledisloe but nothing else.

                        My preferred back three are Barrett (the good one), Rieko and Clarke, with Goodhue and ALB in the midfield.

                        How's that going to happen - Clarke and Rieko both play left wing?

                        KiwiMurphK Offline
                        KiwiMurphK Offline
                        KiwiMurph
                        wrote on last edited by
                        #1005

                        @junior both have played right wing before.

                        1 Reply Last reply
                        2
                        • J Offline
                          J Offline
                          junior
                          wrote on last edited by
                          #1006

                          One thing that people seem to missing in the debate about whether Rieko should be a centre / wing or a wing / centre, is that the midfield mix currently chosen. There's not specialist 12 there, which suggests to me that ALB (at least) and Goodhue (probably) may be seen as primarily 12s for this current squad and Rieko and Ennor as primarily 13s.

                          What this means for the match day squad, I'm not sure, but the selectors may be leaning towards the ALB-Ioane or Goodhue-Ennor midfield combinations rather than the one that started last year's RWC semi (which they've seen and which I think we can all agree was a bit meh).

                          F 1 Reply Last reply
                          0
                          • NepiaN Nepia

                            @junior said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

                            @Nepia said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

                            @MN5 said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

                            @Gunner said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

                            @nzzp @Crucial Bridge = Ralph v 2.0

                            I'll be pissed if they go with the safe boring option. Clarke should be the starter every day of the week ending in a y.

                            Well seeing as tests are often on a Satdee or a Sundee I can see them going with Bridge on occasions.

                            So he'll get the odd Bledisloe but nothing else.

                            My preferred back three are Barrett (the good one), Rieko and Clarke, with Goodhue and ALB in the midfield.

                            How's that going to happen - Clarke and Rieko both play left wing?

                            I didn't know there was a rule that wings are only ever allowed to play one side. 😉

                            J Offline
                            J Offline
                            junior
                            wrote on last edited by
                            #1007

                            @Nepia said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

                            @junior said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

                            @Nepia said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

                            @MN5 said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

                            @Gunner said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

                            @nzzp @Crucial Bridge = Ralph v 2.0

                            I'll be pissed if they go with the safe boring option. Clarke should be the starter every day of the week ending in a y.

                            Well seeing as tests are often on a Satdee or a Sundee I can see them going with Bridge on occasions.

                            So he'll get the odd Bledisloe but nothing else.

                            My preferred back three are Barrett (the good one), Rieko and Clarke, with Goodhue and ALB in the midfield.

                            How's that going to happen - Clarke and Rieko both play left wing?

                            I didn't know there was a rule that wings are only ever allowed to play one side. 😉

                            You must have missed the comments yesterday about picking specialists.

                            1 Reply Last reply
                            0
                            • BonesB Offline
                              BonesB Offline
                              Bones
                              wrote on last edited by
                              #1008

                              Sooo....why the fuck can't Ennor play 12? He's not exactly busting down doors at 13 and Goodhue is suffering as a result...

                              J 1 Reply Last reply
                              2
                              • BonesB Bones

                                Sooo....why the fuck can't Ennor play 12? He's not exactly busting down doors at 13 and Goodhue is suffering as a result...

                                J Offline
                                J Offline
                                junior
                                wrote on last edited by
                                #1009

                                @Bones said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

                                Sooo....why the fuck can't Ennor play 12? He's not exactly busting down doors at 13 and Goodhue is suffering as a result...

                                I don't know, TBH. Maybe he's always played 13 or wing and they feel a shift in one spot is too much at this relatively early stage of his career? To me, he doesn't look like a 12 but, then again, he doesn't look like a 13 (yet) either.

                                1 Reply Last reply
                                0
                                • mariner4lifeM Offline
                                  mariner4lifeM Offline
                                  mariner4life
                                  wrote on last edited by
                                  #1010

                                  Ardie at 8? Yuck

                                  J ACT CrusaderA 2 Replies Last reply
                                  6
                                  • mariner4lifeM mariner4life

                                    Ardie at 8? Yuck

                                    J Offline
                                    J Offline
                                    junior
                                    wrote on last edited by
                                    #1011

                                    @mariner4life said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

                                    Ardie at 8? Yuck

                                    Yep. That's particularly concerning when we've got two big, quick and skilful guys who are specialists in that position in the squad.

                                    mariner4lifeM 1 Reply Last reply
                                    5
                                    • J junior

                                      @mariner4life said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

                                      Ardie at 8? Yuck

                                      Yep. That's particularly concerning when we've got two big, quick and skilful guys who are specialists in that position in the squad.

                                      mariner4lifeM Offline
                                      mariner4lifeM Offline
                                      mariner4life
                                      wrote on last edited by
                                      #1012

                                      @junior said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

                                      @mariner4life said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

                                      Ardie at 8? Yuck

                                      Yep. That's particularly concerning when we've got two big, quick and skilful guys who are specialists in that position in the squad.

                                      He's a fucking 7.

                                      Talk about ignoring lessons

                                      sharkS M P 3 Replies Last reply
                                      6
                                      • C Offline
                                        C Offline
                                        cgrant
                                        wrote on last edited by
                                        #1013

                                        Last Saturday, Laulala was a different beast. During the SRA, he was underwhelming, to say the least. He has cemented a starting spot IMO, which was seriously threatened after his RWC semi-final.

                                        1 Reply Last reply
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                                        • sharkS shark

                                          For what it's worth, my 23:

                                          Moody Ofa T
                                          Taylor Coles
                                          Laulala Lomax
                                          Whitelock
                                          Tuipolutu Strange
                                          Frizzel
                                          Savea Cane
                                          Sotutu

                                          Smith Perenara
                                          Mo'unga
                                          ALB
                                          Goodhue
                                          Clarke R Ioane
                                          Jordan J Barrett
                                          B Barrett

                                          Yeah I know there no chance Savea will usurp Fosters' named skipper, but it's the 23 I'd select.

                                          BovidaeB Offline
                                          BovidaeB Offline
                                          Bovidae
                                          wrote on last edited by
                                          #1014

                                          @shark said in AB squad for the Bledisloe Cup?:

                                          For what it's worth, my 23:

                                          Moody Ofa T

                                          With the 6 props named I don't think you will see much of Ofa at LH again. Cron and Hansen seemed to want to move him there with varying results.

                                          Late in the North-South game when Ofa returned to play LH with Ta'avao at TH and Scrafton at lock, the NI scrum was going backwards.

                                          P 1 Reply Last reply
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