All Blacks vs Springboks - Twickenham
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@pakman said in All Blacks vs Springboks - Twickenham:
And scrum penalty when five yards from our line was also dodgy. Would be interested in what @NTA thought, but to me Malherbe driving up and slightly in, EDG digs in and shoves back, getting under FM's ribs. He has to step back to regain balance and takes scrum down, and EDG with him. A relieving penalty then might well have altered the card dynamic.
Time stamp?
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Watching the Breakdown. Jeff Wilson is spot on re Scott Barrett. Cleanout to shoulder. Lots of other clean outs similar. Should not have been a yellow.
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@NTA About nine minutes of official time.
The scrum a minute later looked to me to be textbook.
@pakman said in All Blacks vs Springboks - Twickenham:
@NTA About nine minutes of official time.
The scrum a minute later looked to me to be textbook.
Let's watch a few eh?
06:25 - solid from both sides. Malherbe has superb control and balance, with his knee nearly on the deck but driving EdG's mass up a tick, while bending his neck down.
09:20 - post-hit:
EdG isn't in great position, arched in the upper back a little.
Lomax's side of the scrum is very low - by the time the camera zooms in, you can already see his knee on the deck through the tunnel.
The call was black THP going to knee. There's no replay angle from that side but you can see it from the open side, and by Coles and EdG having to reset their feet as the motion goes sideways.10:38 - Boks take scrum from that penalty. Whatever Lomax did wrong in the previous scrum, he corrected it. Good scrum. Good contest. Boks called to use it.
12:00 - Boks win the hit. Fucking quick heel from Coles and Ardie is away i.e.
12:02 set called
12:05 ball fed
12:06 Ardie detaches -
@pakman said in All Blacks vs Springboks - Twickenham:
@NTA About nine minutes of official time.
The scrum a minute later looked to me to be textbook.
Let's watch a few eh?
06:25 - solid from both sides. Malherbe has superb control and balance, with his knee nearly on the deck but driving EdG's mass up a tick, while bending his neck down.
09:20 - post-hit:
EdG isn't in great position, arched in the upper back a little.
Lomax's side of the scrum is very low - by the time the camera zooms in, you can already see his knee on the deck through the tunnel.
The call was black THP going to knee. There's no replay angle from that side but you can see it from the open side, and by Coles and EdG having to reset their feet as the motion goes sideways.10:38 - Boks take scrum from that penalty. Whatever Lomax did wrong in the previous scrum, he corrected it. Good scrum. Good contest. Boks called to use it.
12:00 - Boks win the hit. Fucking quick heel from Coles and Ardie is away i.e.
12:02 set called
12:05 ball fed
12:06 Ardie detaches@NTA said in All Blacks vs Springboks - Twickenham:
@pakman said in All Blacks vs Springboks - Twickenham:
@NTA About nine minutes of official time.
The scrum a minute later looked to me to be textbook.
Let's watch a few eh?
06:25 - solid from both sides. Malherbe has superb control and balance, with his knee nearly on the deck but driving EdG up a tick, while bending him down.
09:20 - post-hit:
EdG isn't in great position, arched in the upper back a little.
Lomax's side of the scrum is very low - by the time the camera zooms in, you can already see his knee on the deck through the tunnel.
The call was black THP going to knee. There's no replay angle from that side but you can see it from the open side, and by Coles and EdG having to reset their feet as the motion goes sideways.10:38 - Boks take scrum from that penalty. Whatever Lomax did wrong in the previous scrum, he corrected it. Good scrum. Good contest. Boks called to use it.
12:00 - Boks win the hit. Fucking quick heel from Coles and Ardie is away i.e.
12:02 set called
12:05 ball fed
12:06 Ardie detaches@NTA said in All Blacks vs Springboks - Twickenham:
@pakman said in All Blacks vs Springboks - Twickenham:
@NTA About nine minutes of official time.
The scrum a minute later looked to me to be textbook.
Let's watch a few eh?
06:25 - solid from both sides. Malherbe has superb control and balance, with his knee nearly on the deck but driving EdG up a tick, while bending him down.
09:20 - post-hit:
EdG isn't in great position, arched in the upper back a little.
Lomax's side of the scrum is very low - by the time the camera zooms in, you can already see his knee on the deck through the tunnel.
The call was black THP going to knee. There's no replay angle from that side but you can see it from the open side, and by Coles and EdG having to reset their feet as the motion goes sideways.10:38 - Boks take scrum from that penalty. Whatever Lomax did wrong in the previous scrum, he corrected it. Good scrum. Good contest. Boks called to use it.
12:00 - Boks win the hit. Fucking quick heel from Coles and Ardie is away i.e.
12:02 set called
12:05 ball fed
12:06 Ardie detachesGood stuff! UK feed doesn’t show Lomax side, just EDG appearing to dig himself out of hole and FM hinging to ground. Saffer commentators were calling penalty against EDG!
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@NTA said in All Blacks vs Springboks - Twickenham:
@pakman said in All Blacks vs Springboks - Twickenham:
@NTA About nine minutes of official time.
The scrum a minute later looked to me to be textbook.
Let's watch a few eh?
06:25 - solid from both sides. Malherbe has superb control and balance, with his knee nearly on the deck but driving EdG up a tick, while bending him down.
09:20 - post-hit:
EdG isn't in great position, arched in the upper back a little.
Lomax's side of the scrum is very low - by the time the camera zooms in, you can already see his knee on the deck through the tunnel.
The call was black THP going to knee. There's no replay angle from that side but you can see it from the open side, and by Coles and EdG having to reset their feet as the motion goes sideways.10:38 - Boks take scrum from that penalty. Whatever Lomax did wrong in the previous scrum, he corrected it. Good scrum. Good contest. Boks called to use it.
12:00 - Boks win the hit. Fucking quick heel from Coles and Ardie is away i.e.
12:02 set called
12:05 ball fed
12:06 Ardie detaches@NTA said in All Blacks vs Springboks - Twickenham:
@pakman said in All Blacks vs Springboks - Twickenham:
@NTA About nine minutes of official time.
The scrum a minute later looked to me to be textbook.
Let's watch a few eh?
06:25 - solid from both sides. Malherbe has superb control and balance, with his knee nearly on the deck but driving EdG up a tick, while bending him down.
09:20 - post-hit:
EdG isn't in great position, arched in the upper back a little.
Lomax's side of the scrum is very low - by the time the camera zooms in, you can already see his knee on the deck through the tunnel.
The call was black THP going to knee. There's no replay angle from that side but you can see it from the open side, and by Coles and EdG having to reset their feet as the motion goes sideways.10:38 - Boks take scrum from that penalty. Whatever Lomax did wrong in the previous scrum, he corrected it. Good scrum. Good contest. Boks called to use it.
12:00 - Boks win the hit. Fucking quick heel from Coles and Ardie is away i.e.
12:02 set called
12:05 ball fed
12:06 Ardie detachesGood stuff! UK feed doesn’t show Lomax side, just EDG appearing to dig himself out of hole and FM hinging to ground. Saffer commentators were calling penalty against EDG!
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@pakman said in All Blacks vs Springboks - Twickenham:
@NTA About nine minutes of official time.
The scrum a minute later looked to me to be textbook.
Let's watch a few eh?
06:25 - solid from both sides. Malherbe has superb control and balance, with his knee nearly on the deck but driving EdG's mass up a tick, while bending his neck down.
09:20 - post-hit:
EdG isn't in great position, arched in the upper back a little.
Lomax's side of the scrum is very low - by the time the camera zooms in, you can already see his knee on the deck through the tunnel.
The call was black THP going to knee. There's no replay angle from that side but you can see it from the open side, and by Coles and EdG having to reset their feet as the motion goes sideways.10:38 - Boks take scrum from that penalty. Whatever Lomax did wrong in the previous scrum, he corrected it. Good scrum. Good contest. Boks called to use it.
12:00 - Boks win the hit. Fucking quick heel from Coles and Ardie is away i.e.
12:02 set called
12:05 ball fed
12:06 Ardie detaches -
@His-Bobness said in All Blacks vs Springboks - Twickenham:
@Dan54 My thoughts too. I knew a pasting was coming while watching the anthems. They weren’t up for this at all. And the Springboks clearly were. Mindset, attitude and mental strength are still the key underlying problems, which gets back to my earlier post about the Foster effect. I think he wants to be everyone’s mate, which is fatal for a head coach.
Ties in with my post below.
Too nice to his squad....Waaaaay too nice to refs both in the build up to and after games. Be magnanimous sure, but we are being led a merry dance by the Rassies, Farrells, Sextons and Eddie Jones of the world.
From the social media account right up to the head coach, we have had 6 or 7 years of sniffing our own farts and falling over ourselves to be the good guys on and off the pitch. Rassies video whether you like it or not, turned that Lions series. Simple things like mentioning how Kolisi was not afforded the same audience with the ref as the opposition captain.
The Mako Vunipola smash on Barrett in the same game as the SBW red in 2017 (with differing sanctions) followed by the "we have a deal" Garces special the following week and the resultant shoulder shrugs from our leaders and coaches showed the seeds had been sewn. We went from a team with a 100 year invisibility cloak on, to one who gets carded more than everyone else in the space of a few years up to and including the Taa'vao/Andrew Porter fiasco which again resulted in another bungled home series. And Foster still had nothing to say.
We have turned the other cheek on and off the pitch for too long.
The coaching should be ruthless and the players should be ruthless. Mark Robinson similarly showed a lack of ruthlessness. Kite flying and taking the temperature of the nation before making decisions. Sack him or back him.
I realise the whole “we have a deal” Garces thing wasn’t the point you were trying to make but…
English is not his first language. The French for agreement is accord. It also translates into deal. No conspiracy, just a language blunder.
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High quality ferning @nta and @pakman
Think it’d tempt @Red-Beard and @BartMan out of retirement.
Wish refs would let the packs have at it for at least the first two or three scrums and then only blow the obvious skullduggery. But I feel the same way about mauls and rucks. And lineouts.
Let forwards have a contest and they’ll actually do it - leaving space for the glory boys, opensides, to score tries. Put another way: marginal whistles tend to protect weaker teams and encourage gamesmanship.
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High quality ferning @nta and @pakman
Think it’d tempt @Red-Beard and @BartMan out of retirement.
Wish refs would let the packs have at it for at least the first two or three scrums and then only blow the obvious skullduggery. But I feel the same way about mauls and rucks. And lineouts.
Let forwards have a contest and they’ll actually do it - leaving space for the glory boys, opensides, to score tries. Put another way: marginal whistles tend to protect weaker teams and encourage gamesmanship.
@Smuts said in All Blacks vs Springboks - Twickenham:
High quality ferning @nta and @pakman
Think it’d tempt @Red-Beard and @BartMan out of retirement.
Wish refs would let the packs have at it for at least the first two or three scrums and then only blow the obvious skullduggery. But I feel the same way about mauls and rucks. And lineouts.
Let forwards have a contest and they’ll actually do it - leaving space for the glory boys, opensides, to score tries. Put another way: marginal whistles tend to protect weaker teams and encourage gamesmanship.
A very good point.
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There's too much negativity on here. We can still win this.
Didn't have a shit show vs SA after 15 minutes man down and penalty avalanche.
Schmidt and Ryan are smart will adapt.
Cut out all cute shite inside our own half.
Use JB's boot more.
Value territory more.
Fast paced pick n goes.
Patience be prepared to go through the phases.
We have played some outstanding rugby in the last 9 months. We can do it -
I hope we can. Know we can't. Foster simply hasn't given the A team enough time together. Hell, 2007, 2011, 2015 we pretty much had the same team of core players. A year out from the RWC Foster almost loses to Scotland, England and Japan because he keeps changing the side. 2023, he had the opportunity to play most of the squad through Bled II and SA with weeks between each test and didn't. They aren't fatigued. I predicted we would lose this test, I didn't predict we'd lose so badly.
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@Higgins said in All Blacks vs Springboks - Twickenham:
@ACT-Crusader said in All Blacks vs Springboks - Twickenham:
@Machpants said in All Blacks vs Springboks - Twickenham:
@antipodean said in All Blacks vs Springboks - Twickenham:
@Machpants said in All Blacks vs Springboks - Twickenham:
And he can't own up when his team puts what is objectively the worst performance ever in black
Utter fucking nonsense.
So a28 point loss isn't objectively the worst ever? Carry on in your dream world. He at no point in the interview admits anything but good learnings. Not 'we didn't prepare well enough' nor 'the tactics weren't quite right' doing shitty little kicks in our 22.Just we will learn. Except they don't and haven't over the last 6 odd years
Losing to Munster 12-0 in 78 is the worst ever…
No it's not, I well remember a real spanking against Sydney 17 - 40 at Penrith in 1992 that was the ultimate pits. That's the same year we had an unbeaten tour of Sth Africa!
That NSW side was basically the Wallabies other than about 3 players. And I think the margin was bigger than that!
@ACT-Crusader said in All Blacks vs Springboks - Twickenham:
@Higgins said in All Blacks vs Springboks - Twickenham:
@ACT-Crusader said in All Blacks vs Springboks - Twickenham:
@Machpants said in All Blacks vs Springboks - Twickenham:
@antipodean said in All Blacks vs Springboks - Twickenham:
@Machpants said in All Blacks vs Springboks - Twickenham:
And he can't own up when his team puts what is objectively the worst performance ever in black
Utter fucking nonsense.
So a28 point loss isn't objectively the worst ever? Carry on in your dream world. He at no point in the interview admits anything but good learnings. Not 'we didn't prepare well enough' nor 'the tactics weren't quite right' doing shitty little kicks in our 22.Just we will learn. Except they don't and haven't over the last 6 odd years
Losing to Munster 12-0 in 78 is the worst ever…
No it's not, I well remember a real spanking against Sydney 17 - 40 at Penrith in 1992 that was the ultimate pits. That's the same year we had an unbeaten tour of Sth Africa!
That NSW side was basically the Wallabies other than about 3 players.
Literally everything you've said there is wrong. It was a Sydney invitational, not NSW and none of the starting XVs were the same.
Sydney:
M. N. Hartill
M. Bell
A. Blades
T. Kava (C)
W. W. Waugh
M. C. Brial
S. P. Poidevin
B. T. Gavin
A. Ekert
T. Wallace
P. Jorgensen
L. F. Walker
R. C. Tombs
D. K. Junee
T. P. KelaherWallabies:
A. J. Daly
P. N. Kearns
E. J. A. McKenzie
R. J. McCall
J. A. Eales
T. Coker
D. J. Wilson
S. J. N. Scott-Young
N. C. Farr-Jones (C)
M. P. Lynagh
P. V. Carozza
T. J. Horan
J. S. Little
D. I. Campese
M. C. Roebuck -
There's too much negativity on here. We can still win this.
Didn't have a shit show vs SA after 15 minutes man down and penalty avalanche.
Schmidt and Ryan are smart will adapt.
Cut out all cute shite inside our own half.
Use JB's boot more.
Value territory more.
Fast paced pick n goes.
Patience be prepared to go through the phases.
We have played some outstanding rugby in the last 9 months. We can do it@BerniesCorner My guess is that we’ll go deep into this competition, but not win it. Semi Finalist and Finalist, we’ve got lots of talent and the ability to play in multiple ways. I think Friday night was something of a perfect storm.
But we are still not the strongest up front, nor do we have the leadership to cope where multiple things go wrong or lots of bad luck.
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There's too much negativity on here. We can still win this.
Didn't have a shit show vs SA after 15 minutes man down and penalty avalanche.
Schmidt and Ryan are smart will adapt.
Cut out all cute shite inside our own half.
Use JB's boot more.
Value territory more.
Fast paced pick n goes.
Patience be prepared to go through the phases.
We have played some outstanding rugby in the last 9 months. We can do it@BerniesCorner said in All Blacks vs Springboks - Twickenham:
There's too much negativity on here. We can still win this.
Didn't have a shit show vs SA after 15 minutes man down and penalty avalanche.
Schmidt and Ryan are smart will adapt.
Cut out all cute shite inside our own half.
Use JB's boot more.
Value territory more.
Fast paced pick n goes.
Patience be prepared to go through the phases.
We have played some outstanding rugby in the last 9 months. We can do itThe problem is everything you mention above has been known for a long time and the fact Foster has not implemented it is very concerning.
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@BerniesCorner My guess is that we’ll go deep into this competition, but not win it. Semi Finalist and Finalist, we’ve got lots of talent and the ability to play in multiple ways. I think Friday night was something of a perfect storm.
But we are still not the strongest up front, nor do we have the leadership to cope where multiple things go wrong or lots of bad luck.
@sparky said in All Blacks vs Springboks - Twickenham:
@BerniesCorner My guess is that we’ll go deep into this competition, but not win it. Semi Finalist and Finalist, we’ve got lots of talent and the ability to play in multiple ways. I think Friday night was something of a perfect storm.
But we are still not the strongest up front, nor do we have the leadership to cope where multiple things go wrong or lots of bad luck.
If I had to take a stab , I would guess we will have a significant victory somewhere, where the faith gets restored ( like mt smart )
Then follow that up with a significant loss , just feels like a destiny thing with this team to me .
But I want that to be wrong and I’ll be celebrating more than anyone should we pull it off .
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@MiketheSnow said in All Blacks vs Springboks - Twickenham:
@kev said in All Blacks vs Springboks - Twickenham:
Watching the Breakdown. Jeff Wilson is spot on re Scott Barrett. Cleanout to shoulder. Lots of other clean outs similar. Should not have been a yellow.
Absolute nonsense
He came from distance at speed and hit a player that was not affecting the outcome of the ruck and who was unsighted and unable to defend himself
Scooter’s clean out had no influence on the outcome of that breakdown
On the clumsy to filth scale where clumsy is 1 and filth is 10 this rates between 6 and 7 for me and deservedly merited a YC
I don’t mind the fact that someone in our team felt compelled to whack Marx, even if it was a bit of a cheap shot - but it was just on the wrong side of the line between enforcement and grubbery given Marx was prone - if he’d done something similar while Marx was standing in the ruck we’d all be applauding it
@junior and this is the problem with players cleaning out as they continue to do (something that we have seen throughout the past couple of years)
Fly in at pace, throwing themselves at a player who is being a nuisance but not really affecting things, all it would have taken was for Marx to twist slightly and SB could be facing a long ban.
If players had to bind prior to hitting a ruck it would take away some of these exocet clean outs and refs were tougher on players lying around the ball too.
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@sparky said in All Blacks vs Springboks - Twickenham:
@BerniesCorner My guess is that we’ll go deep into this competition, but not win it. Semi Finalist and Finalist, we’ve got lots of talent and the ability to play in multiple ways. I think Friday night was something of a perfect storm.
But we are still not the strongest up front, nor do we have the leadership to cope where multiple things go wrong or lots of bad luck.
If I had to take a stab , I would guess we will have a significant victory somewhere, where the faith gets restored ( like mt smart )
Then follow that up with a significant loss , just feels like a destiny thing with this team to me .
But I want that to be wrong and I’ll be celebrating more than anyone should we pull it off .
@kiwiinmelb said in All Blacks vs Springboks - Twickenham:
@sparky said in All Blacks vs Springboks - Twickenham:
@BerniesCorner My guess is that we’ll go deep into this competition, but not win it. Semi Finalist and Finalist, we’ve got lots of talent and the ability to play in multiple ways. I think Friday night was something of a perfect storm.
But we are still not the strongest up front, nor do we have the leadership to cope where multiple things go wrong or lots of bad luck.
If I had to take a stab , I would guess we will have a significant victory somewhere, where the faith gets restored ( like mt smart )
Then follow that up with a significant loss , just feels like a destiny thing with this team to me .
But I want that to be wrong and I’ll be celebrating more than anyone should we pull it off .
Yeah. I see us potentially hammering France in the opening game then getting done in the quarters. Or perhaps a repeat of 2019 - qf reaming then poor sf loss. This team just seems much too flaky to win a tournament like this.
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@kiwiinmelb said in All Blacks vs Springboks - Twickenham:
@sparky said in All Blacks vs Springboks - Twickenham:
@BerniesCorner My guess is that we’ll go deep into this competition, but not win it. Semi Finalist and Finalist, we’ve got lots of talent and the ability to play in multiple ways. I think Friday night was something of a perfect storm.
But we are still not the strongest up front, nor do we have the leadership to cope where multiple things go wrong or lots of bad luck.
If I had to take a stab , I would guess we will have a significant victory somewhere, where the faith gets restored ( like mt smart )
Then follow that up with a significant loss , just feels like a destiny thing with this team to me .
But I want that to be wrong and I’ll be celebrating more than anyone should we pull it off .
Yeah. I see us potentially hammering France in the opening game then getting done in the quarters. Or perhaps a repeat of 2019 - qf reaming then poor sf loss. This team just seems much too flaky to win a tournament like this.
@Rancid-Schnitzel winning 3 big games on the trot (especially when you consider who the 1st 2 are likely to be) was always going to be hard, regardless of how we were tracking, but agree this side seems to lack the instincts and adaptability to do it.
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@Rancid-Schnitzel winning 3 big games on the trot (especially when you consider who the 1st 2 are likely to be) was always going to be hard, regardless of how we were tracking, but agree this side seems to lack the instincts and adaptability to do it.
@taniwharugby said in All Blacks vs Springboks - Twickenham:
@Rancid-Schnitzel winning 3 big games on the trot (especially when you consider who the 1st 2 are likely to be) was always going to be hard, regardless of how we were tracking, but agree this side seems to lack the instincts and adaptability to do it.
It think it was mentioned that it's about winning despite having an off day. That used to be an AB speciality. Now if we have an off day we fall apart and get spanked.
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Well it's good to see Foster is back to his record setting ways, though I don't think he'll be able to grace us with anymore records at the RWC as we've already been bundled out in the 1/4 finals prior and I don't think he'll be able to top that.
Our forward pack got bullied and beaten up, unfortunately without BBR, Scooter (to stay on the field) and Frizzle (can't believe I'm saying that) we lacked the ability to carry the ball forward. The thing is those 3 can carry the ball, their replacements just can't.
We play a pod system which is only effective if you break the advantage line (you need a good ball carrier in each pod) to get you quick ball and go-forward otherwise you simply go sideways across the field. RM and BB then lack a tactical distance kicking game to get us out of trouble so lots of lateral movement stuck in our own half going for cute plays to try and generate some attack.
Defense was brave but again we lost the physical battle, it's pretty easy to not give away penalties - you don't put your hands in the ruck and you make sure your behind the last feet. However if your doing that but just getting beaten up and loosing meters then sometimes it boils down to pushing the envelope to try and slow the ball down or turn it over and thus penalties ensue.
I would hope it's that and not the fact that the players don't trust each other or the defensive patterns to work hence they "take it upon themselves". That's the worst case scenario though given McLeod's defensive patterns of late it might be true.
Just a horror game, we can only flush the dunny and move on, RSA prime favorites to take this RWC at a canter unless Ireland or France can bully their forward pack.
