All Blacks 2024
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If it helps you I'd rather see Sotutu at 8.
I think if you're going to make extreme claims that he has been complete shit then there needs to be something in the stats to confirm that and there isn't. Then you've got three different media outlets rating him an 8 or a 7 in both games.
It's just not adding up.
Personally I would have rated him a 7 in both Bledisloe games.
Cane was the one that was rubbish in both games. You could tell that Cane was disappointed when he came off with his game. I saw that watching, I saw it in the ratings, I saw it in the stats.
@brodean said in All Blacks 2024:
Then you've got three different media outlets rating him an 8 or a 7 in both games.
the same media outlets concluding that Beaudy is our 10 forever and thoroughly outplayed DMac? Those media outlets?
The analysis on here is usually miles ahead of the media. The sauce is better, too
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I'm not saying Savea should be our No 8 but that doesn't mean he's played badly.
Sititi has been great but is unproven against top teams. He went missing in the physicality stakes in the SRP final and he got bullied a bit physically in SA so he still had some development in front of him.
There are people who are creaming their panties about Sititis form against the Wallabies and these are often the same people who said Akira Ioanes motm performances against Australia don't count.
@brodean said in All Blacks 2024:
Sititi has been great but is unproven against top teams. He went missing in the physicality stakes in the SRP final
This is simply not true. He topped both tackles and carries for the Chiefs. He was excellent in a team that was thrashed.
I remember it pretty well, because my thoughts after watching him the week before in the Hurricanes demolition were 'let's see how he goes when the shoe is on the other foot'. -
@brodean said in All Blacks 2024:
Then you've got three different media outlets rating him an 8 or a 7 in both games.
the same media outlets concluding that Beaudy is our 10 forever and thoroughly outplayed DMac? Those media outlets?
The analysis on here is usually miles ahead of the media. The sauce is better, too
@nzzp said in All Blacks 2024:
@brodean said in All Blacks 2024:
Then you've got three different media outlets rating him an 8 or a 7 in both games.
the same media outlets concluding that Beaudy is our 10 forever and thoroughly outplayed DMac? Those media outlets?
The analysis on here is usually miles ahead of the media. The sauce is better, too
Wot? That is a sad reflection on the media. Bloody hell!
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https://super.rugby/therugbychampionship/competition-stats/
Savea
No 1 for carries
No 2 for tackles
No 4 for defenders beaten
No 8 for lineouts@brodean said in All Blacks 2024:
https://super.rugby/therugbychampionship/competition-stats/
Savea
No 1 for carries
No 2 for tackles
No 4 for defenders beaten
No 8 for lineoutsLet's accept for the sake of argument that those stats are accurate. It raises two issues for me:
- How much better would Sititi (or Sotutu) have gone in that position instead?
- Why has a loose forward with 70% more carries than the next bloke not made the top 10 for metres gained? Taylor managed to. Especially if he's number one for defenders beaten? How is it Sititi can get in the top 10 of the competition for offloads despite playing vastly less and Savea couldn't?
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lol at media ratings.
a 7? In Bledisloe 1?? How many times did he lose the ball in contact??
Media ratings aren't perfect but you'd expect to see at least one dudding him if your claims were based in reality.
Savea has made more carries than any other player in the tournament so I would expect he also turns the ball over more.
From the All Blacks Savea is ranked 11th for turnovers conceded per carry.
0.67 Narawa
0.62 Ratima
0.25 Ioane, Jacobson
0.24 Perenara
0.22 BB
0.17 Bell
0.15 Reece
0.14 Scott Barrett, Lomax, Darry
0.13 Tuipulotu, Newell, Papali''i
0.10 Mckenzie, Tele'a, Proctor, Williams, Jordan
0.09 SaveaIf you want to drop Savea for conceding turnovers you should drop all those other players first.
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Media ratings aren't perfect but you'd expect to see at least one dudding him if your claims were based in reality.
Savea has made more carries than any other player in the tournament so I would expect he also turns the ball over more.
From the All Blacks Savea is ranked 11th for turnovers conceded per carry.
0.67 Narawa
0.62 Ratima
0.25 Ioane, Jacobson
0.24 Perenara
0.22 BB
0.17 Bell
0.15 Reece
0.14 Scott Barrett, Lomax, Darry
0.13 Tuipulotu, Newell, Papali''i
0.10 Mckenzie, Tele'a, Proctor, Williams, Jordan
0.09 SaveaIf you want to drop Savea for conceding turnovers you should drop all those other players first.
@brodean said in All Blacks 2024:
From the All Blacks Savea is ranked 19th for turnovers conceded per carry.
Do they split out players who turned over the ball because the cleaners weren't fast or accurate enough from the players that just spilt it cold in the tackle..?
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@brodean said in All Blacks 2024:
https://super.rugby/therugbychampionship/competition-stats/
Savea
No 1 for carries
No 2 for tackles
No 4 for defenders beaten
No 8 for lineoutsLet's accept for the sake of argument that those stats are accurate. It raises two issues for me:
- How much better would Sititi (or Sotutu) have gone in that position instead?
- Why has a loose forward with 70% more carries than the next bloke not made the top 10 for metres gained? Taylor managed to. Especially if he's number one for defenders beaten? How is it Sititi can get in the top 10 of the competition for offloads despite playing vastly less and Savea couldn't?
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@brodean said in All Blacks 2024:
From the All Blacks Savea is ranked 19th for turnovers conceded per carry.
Do they split out players who turned over the ball because the cleaners weren't fast or accurate enough from the players that just spilt it cold in the tackle..?
@antipodean said in All Blacks 2024:
@brodean said in All Blacks 2024:
From the All Blacks Savea is ranked 19th for turnovers conceded per carry.
Do they split out players who turned over the ball because the cleaners weren't fast or accurate enough from the players that just spilt it cold in the tackle..?
When Akira Ioane turned the ball over it was because he ran away from his support or didn't stay on his feet long enough but when Ethan Blackadder turned the ball over it was because the support runners/cleaners weren't quick enough.
There's all kinds of double standards for favourites.
Savea does whats needed to retain the ball. He runs the ball closer to the middle than what Taylor does.
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Taylor spends all his time out on the wing. Savea is very rarely on the wing.
BTW I'm not arguing that Savea should be retained at 8. I'm saying he's not been as bad as some are claiming and Cane has been a lot worse.
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@brodean said in All Blacks 2024:
Taylor spends all his time out on the wing
Well that's BS too he has carried up the guts a lot this season.
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No he hasn't. He's very ineffective close in. He makes metres in the open and that's been his way his entire career. It's chalk and cheese when you compare him to Taukei'aho.
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@brodean said in All Blacks 2024:
No he hasn't. He's very ineffective close in. He makes metres in the open.
Yes he has watch the games.That is BS Savea is positioned in the centres mostly running at the opposition backline.
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A perfect example is the weekend when the AB's tight five were completely ineffective making metres up the middle until William's came on. Taylor regularly pops up on the wing in every game.
@brodean said in All Blacks 2024:
A perfect example is the weekend when the AB's tight five were completely ineffective making metres up the middle until William's came on.
I agree Savea made a shitload off those carries and was ineffective as was Degroot.
Taylor did get over the advantage line. -
@brodean said in All Blacks 2024:
A perfect example is the weekend when the AB's tight five were completely ineffective making metres up the middle until William's came on.
I agree Savea made a shitload off those carries and was ineffective as was Degroot.
Taylor did get over the advantage line.Total Impacts Per 80 Minutes 2025
(Impacts) tries + try assists + clean breaks + offloads + defenders beaten + turnovers won + dominant tacklesForwards
8.16 Sititi
6.39 Savea
5.19 Aumua
4.75 Finau
3.74 Darry
3.46 TaylorThat's top 6. Some how Savea has done nothing while Taylor has done it all.
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Total Impacts Per 80 Minutes 2025
(Impacts) tries + try assists + clean breaks + offloads + defenders beaten + turnovers won + dominant tacklesForwards
8.16 Sititi
6.39 Savea
5.19 Aumua
4.75 Finau
3.74 Darry
3.46 TaylorThat's top 6. Some how Savea has done nothing while Taylor has done it all.
@brodean said in All Blacks 2024:
Total Impacts Per 80 Minutes 2025
(Impacts) tries + try assists + clean breaks + offloads + defenders beaten + turnovers won + dominant tacklesForwards
8.16 Sititi
6.39 Savea
5.19 Aumua
4.75 Finau
3.74 Darry
3.46 TaylorThat's top 6. Some how Savea has done nothing while Taylor has done it all.
And somehow Finau and Aumua who have been average are there.
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@brodean said in All Blacks 2024:
Total Impacts Per 80 Minutes 2025
(Impacts) tries + try assists + clean breaks + offloads + defenders beaten + turnovers won + dominant tacklesForwards
8.16 Sititi
6.39 Savea
5.19 Aumua
4.75 Finau
3.74 Darry
3.46 TaylorThat's top 6. Some how Savea has done nothing while Taylor has done it all.
And somehow Finau and Aumua who have been average are there.
Both Aumua, and Finau have helped us get our only wins this year against a top 5 team.
Who is your loose forward trio?
Would you have at hooker instead of Aumua?
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Total Impacts Per 80 Minutes 2025
(Impacts) tries + try assists + clean breaks + offloads + defenders beaten + turnovers won + dominant tacklesForwards
8.16 Sititi
6.39 Savea
5.19 Aumua
4.75 Finau
3.74 Darry
3.46 TaylorThat's top 6. Some how Savea has done nothing while Taylor has done it all.
@brodean said in All Blacks 2024:
Total Impacts Per 80 Minutes 2025
(Impacts) tries + try assists + clean breaks + offloads + defenders beaten + turnovers won + dominant tacklesForwards
8.16 Sititi
6.39 Savea
5.19 Aumua
4.75 Finau
3.74 Darry
3.46 TaylorThat's top 6. Some how Savea has done nothing while Taylor has done it all.
how many straight lineout has savea thrown? its almost as if different roles have different criteria
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@brodean said in All Blacks 2024:
Total Impacts Per 80 Minutes 2025
(Impacts) tries + try assists + clean breaks + offloads + defenders beaten + turnovers won + dominant tacklesForwards
8.16 Sititi
6.39 Savea
5.19 Aumua
4.75 Finau
3.74 Darry
3.46 TaylorThat's top 6. Some how Savea has done nothing while Taylor has done it all.
how many straight lineout has savea thrown? its almost as if different roles have different criteria
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I don't recall Savea throwing into the lineout.
@brodean thats the point, taylor isn't high on that list.....but under different criteria (because his role is different).....he's much better
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Total Impacts Per 80 Minutes 2025
(Impacts) tries + try assists + clean breaks + offloads + defenders beaten + turnovers won + dominant tacklesForwards
8.16 Sititi
6.39 Savea
5.19 Aumua
4.75 Finau
3.74 Darry
3.46 TaylorThat's top 6. Some how Savea has done nothing while Taylor has done it all.
@brodean said in All Blacks 2024:
Total Impacts Per 80 Minutes 2025
(Impacts) tries + try assists + clean breaks + offloads + defenders beaten + turnovers won + dominant tacklesForwards
8.16 Sititi
6.39 Savea
5.19 Aumua
4.75 Finau
3.74 Darry
3.46 TaylorThat's top 6. Some how Savea has done nothing while Taylor has done it all.
Breakdown impact per tackle and the impact per metres gain in which area of the field running against tight forwards or inside backs etc
You can quote stats all you like it doesn’t show up on a spreadsheet how it relates to the game situation.
It is not a bible to quote from.
