Italy v All Blacks

Mr Fish

@Mr-Fish said in Italy v All Blacks:

New caps that played (significant minutes) against strong opposition:
Pasilio Tosi
Sam Darry
Wallace Sititi
Pete Lakai
Cortez Ratima

Other new caps:
George Bell
Noah Hotham
Harry Plummer
Billy Proctor
Ruben Love

Unused players brought into the squad:
Brodie McAlister
Fabian Holland
Christian Lio-Willie
Du'Plessis Kirifi
AJ Lam
Chay Fihaki

Youngsters that played (significant minutes) against experienced opposition:
Samipeni Finau
Cam Roigard
Stephen Perofeta

Other youngsters:
Josh Lord
Emoni Narawa

Think that's everyone?

You are missing Slater, Walker Leawere and Haig for starters. This group are not good at keeping the fans informed on who is coming and going.

I've sort ofintentionally left out guys who were just injury cover for a week because there was never really any chance of them featuring but possible I got one or two wrong. Gilbert was in there as a body at one point too.

Jet

@Bones said in Italy v All Blacks:

@Mr-Fish is Perofeta really a youngster?

I watched Perofeta steer the Blues around to beat the British and Irish Lions 7 years ago.

Jet

@antipodean said in Italy v All Blacks:

@Mr-Fish said in Italy v All Blacks:

Harry Plummer

Who will forget his one and only cap. Two minutes on the field and didn't touch the ball. Great coaching.

I know nothing more about Plummer, Narawa, AJ Lam, Proctor (and Love to an extent), than I did before they came on tour.

A waste of Kerosene.

Mr Fish

@Jet said in Italy v All Blacks:

@antipodean said in Italy v All Blacks:

@Mr-Fish said in Italy v All Blacks:

Harry Plummer

Who will forget his one and only cap. Two minutes on the field and didn't touch the ball. Great coaching.

I know nothing more about Plummer, Narawa, AJ Lam, Proctor (and Love to an extent), than I did before they came on tour.

A waste of Kerosene.

To be fair, it's probably quite a bit more important that Robertson knows more about these guys than you and I'm sure he's learned a lot about them.

nostrildamus

@Mr-Fish said in Italy v All Blacks:

@Jet said in Italy v All Blacks:

@antipodean said in Italy v All Blacks:

@Mr-Fish said in Italy v All Blacks:

Harry Plummer

Who will forget his one and only cap. Two minutes on the field and didn't touch the ball. Great coaching.

I know nothing more about Plummer, Narawa, AJ Lam, Proctor (and Love to an extent), than I did before they came on tour.

A waste of Kerosene.

To be fair, it's probably quite a bit more important that Robertson knows more about these guys than you and I'm sure he's learned a lot about them.

That's fair but I'd say seeing them actually play in a test is the best test.
And I still don't understand why they play Havili not Lam.

KiwiMurph

@Billy-Tell said in Italy v All Blacks:

I don’t have such a problem with Havili on the bench. But it does my head in that it’s not

10 McKenzie
15 Love
22 Perofeta (or swap with Love)

And the argument for Havili over Lam in the 23 jersey for this hypothetical backline would be what exactly? Given the 3 players above all cover 10 and 15?

Bovidae

@nostrildamus said in Italy v All Blacks:

And I still don't understand why they play Havili not Lam.

It would be an admission that they got the original squad selection wrong.

canefan

@Bovidae said in Italy v All Blacks:

@nostrildamus said in Italy v All Blacks:

And I still don't understand why they play Havili not Lam.

It would be an admission that they got the original squad selection wrong.

Stuff that. Just play the guys that are most capable. No more teacher's pets

nostrildamus

@KiwiMurph said in Italy v All Blacks:

And the argument for Havili over Lam in the 23 jersey for this hypothetical backline would be what exactly? Given the 3 players above all cover 10 and 15?

I think we agree there isn't much reason. Havili is a test 12, not a 13 or a 10, no longer a 15, and we have plenty of ex / part-time 15s.

MN5

@nostrildamus said in Italy v All Blacks:

@KiwiMurph said in Italy v All Blacks:

And the argument for Havili over Lam in the 23 jersey for this hypothetical backline would be what exactly? Given the 3 players above all cover 10 and 15?

I think we agree there isn't much reason. Havili is a test 12, not a 13 or a 10, no longer a 15, and we have plenty of ex / part-time 15s.

Even that’s optimistic

nostrildamus

@MN5 said in Italy v All Blacks:

@nostrildamus said in Italy v All Blacks:

@KiwiMurph said in Italy v All Blacks:

And the argument for Havili over Lam in the 23 jersey for this hypothetical backline would be what exactly? Given the 3 players above all cover 10 and 15?

I think we agree there isn't much reason. Havili is a test 12, not a 13 or a 10, no longer a 15, and we have plenty of ex / part-time 15s.

Even that’s optimistic

Yeah I read it again and thought why was I so nice? I don't rate him at 12 either. When he started under Foster I saw the potential but I really don't think he has been good enough in any position he played in to get the selections he has - then again I am no AB coach.

Crazy Horse

@KiwiMurph said in Italy v All Blacks:

@Billy-Tell said in Italy v All Blacks:

I don’t have such a problem with Havili on the bench. But it does my head in that it’s not

10 McKenzie
15 Love
22 Perofeta (or swap with Love)

And the argument for Havili over Lam in the 23 jersey for this hypothetical backline would be what exactly? Given the 3 players above all cover 10 and 15?

I have said this a number of times, I am not a fan of Havilii, but I can get his selection over Lam, at this stage. Lam has not had a lot of time in the midfield, and owing to the way the Blues played he has not had the chance to show he is a ball player. Next year if he plays midfield and gets to show he is at least the equal to Jordie as a passer, then yes, pick him. They'd be fools not to.

Duluth

@Crazy-Horse said in Italy v All Blacks:

Lam has not had a lot of time in the midfield

He's already had 22 first class starts in the midfield. Obviously he has shifted there late in games too.

Machpants

@Duluth said in Italy v All Blacks:

@Crazy-Horse said in Italy v All Blacks:

Lam has not had a lot of time in the midfield

He's already had 22 first class starts in the midfield. Obviously he has shifted there late in games too.

A few more than Sititi at 6

nostrildamus

Considering how troublesome finding a 6 has been, considering he isn't that big and plays at 8, throwing Sititi in there was inspired. Or ballsy. Or desperate. But well done him. I'm also on the Sititi as future AB captain bandwagon. Hope that isn't a jinx.

KiwiMurph

@Crazy-Horse said in Italy v All Blacks:

I have said this a number of times, I am not a fan of Havilii, but I can get his selection over Lam, at this stage. Lam has not had a lot of time in the midfield, and owing to the way the Blues played he has not had the chance to show he is a ball player.

We don't have ball players in the midfield now. Lam has looked good in midfield for Blues (including 3 playoff games), a bad Auckland NPC team and an AB XV game.

I don't understand the fear at all.

Meanwhile how many games has Havili played at 13? I don't recall him playing there at all.

sparky

This post is deleted!

canefan

@KiwiMurph said in Italy v All Blacks:

@Crazy-Horse said in Italy v All Blacks:

Meanwhile how many games has Havili played at 13? I don't recall him playing there at all.

It's a poor excuse to justify retaining a player who IMHO doesn't deserve to be there

Crazy Horse

@canefan said in Italy v All Blacks:

@KiwiMurph said in Italy v All Blacks:

@Crazy-Horse said in Italy v All Blacks:

Meanwhile how many games has Havili played at 13? I don't recall him playing there at all.

It's a poor excuse to justify retaining a player who IMHO doesn't deserve to be there

Maybe, but it was an attempt to see their reasoning.

Billy Tell

@KiwiMurph said in Italy v All Blacks:

@Billy-Tell said in Italy v All Blacks:

I don’t have such a problem with Havili on the bench. But it does my head in that it’s not

10 McKenzie
15 Love
22 Perofeta (or swap with Love)

And the argument for Havili over Lam in the 23 jersey for this hypothetical backline would be what exactly? Given the 3 players above all cover 10 and 15?

I think Havili was in the squad and Lam was added later. It would therefore be odd to promote Lam. The coaches also have to think of squad harmony etc. If you parachute players in and play them ahead of original squad picks, Qs will be asked.

The Silver Fern

Italy v All Blacks