Scotland v All Blacks
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@Mauss said in Scotland v All Blacks:
@pakman said in Scotland v All Blacks:
Anyone got a link to good stats database covering game? Interested in tackle completions/misses by player.
The RugbyPass match page has a reasonable statistical overview:
New Zealand vs Scotland | Scotland vs New Zealand | Match Stats | Internationals Live
Looking for New Zealand vs Scotland? We got you covered. We have the most up to date scores, game stats & results here.
Their stats for tackles completed/missed are relatively reliable, although sometimes I end up with slightly different numbers. To use a somewhat controversial example around here: RugbyPass recorded just the one tackle for Frizell in the RWC final but when I watched it again, I saw him make multiple completed attempts.
So if you really want to make sure, I still think it's best to player-cam the specific player (although that's obviously quite time-consuming, especially if you can't speed up the footage).
Have you given us a match review yet Mauss?
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@canefan said in Scotland v All Blacks:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Scotland v All Blacks:
@taniwharugby said in Scotland v All Blacks:
@Mr-Fish unfortunately both Fozzie and Razor were reluctant to really push the boat out and be bold.with some selections, instead just kept on selecting players despite obvious replacements not.being there.
Which one 1 hand is why they played these guys as much, but it also puts a roadblock up.
For Fozzie, we were lucky with Aaron Smiths form.and longevity, but for Razor, every test BB plays is another Dmac doesn't get or Jacomb or Reihana dont either, and while they may not seem ready, some players respond to the .higher level better, but if they never get a chance to.
What disappoints with Robertson is he had 4 uninterrupted years to really develop players and gameplans. Instead there seems a continuing reliance on the old guard with injury being the main engine of change.
Two years into the cycle and I don't see a structure that will get us to RWC glory. Maybe we just aren't seeing the whole picture
Remember our forward pack a couple of years ago. Light years ahead now. At one stage we didn't have a prop.
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@canefan said in Scotland v All Blacks:
Have you given us a match review yet Mauss?
Well, I don't know if I would call it a review but I did look at the game a bit more closely, by focusing on how the return of the offload in recent Tests has influenced the AB attack.
It's post #962 in this thread.
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@BerniesCorner said in Scotland v All Blacks:
@canefan said in Scotland v All Blacks:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Scotland v All Blacks:
@taniwharugby said in Scotland v All Blacks:
@Mr-Fish unfortunately both Fozzie and Razor were reluctant to really push the boat out and be bold.with some selections, instead just kept on selecting players despite obvious replacements not.being there.
Which one 1 hand is why they played these guys as much, but it also puts a roadblock up.
For Fozzie, we were lucky with Aaron Smiths form.and longevity, but for Razor, every test BB plays is another Dmac doesn't get or Jacomb or Reihana dont either, and while they may not seem ready, some players respond to the .higher level better, but if they never get a chance to.
What disappoints with Robertson is he had 4 uninterrupted years to really develop players and gameplans. Instead there seems a continuing reliance on the old guard with injury being the main engine of change.
Two years into the cycle and I don't see a structure that will get us to RWC glory. Maybe we just aren't seeing the whole picture
Remember our forward pack a couple of years ago. Light years ahead now. At one stage we didn't have a prop.
Tight 5 are on track. Loosies are a mish mash complicated by Ardie being first man on the sheet. Backline a work in progress to put it nicely
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It's probably going to be Savea-Sititi and Lakai this Saturday v England. We are going to find out a lot about the loosies. The combo wasn't a problem v Scotland. Looks like Lakai could be a long term prospect.
The running of S-S-L is pretty hard to counter for the opposition. -
@BerniesCorner I want Parker in 23, and think it makes sense for him to start. Wally is brilliant to come off bench at about 50.
Flexibility to end with SSP or SSL depending on how things are panning out. -
Fair point, cant argue with that.
My brain still thinks rugby is a 15 man game with oranges at half time but that's just me. -
@BerniesCorner said in Scotland v All Blacks:
Remember our forward pack a couple of years ago.
Yep, sure do.
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Ok. 3 years ago
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@BerniesCorner said in Scotland v All Blacks:
Ok. 3 years ago
Ah, those far-off days when we actually won Rugby Championships....
I think the forwards certainly have more potential and depth than 2-3 years ago and the likes of Tupou Vaa'i & De Groot from that period have really grown, but we haven't a settled & balanced 6/7/8 playing well together yet. Good foundations though.
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@Victor-Meldrew said in Scotland v All Blacks:
What disappoints with Robertson is he had 4 uninterrupted years to really develop players and gameplans. Instead there seems a continuing reliance on the old guard with injury being the main engine of change.
4 years? He started Nov 2023 and his first game was in 2024?
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@nostrildamus said in Scotland v All Blacks:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Scotland v All Blacks:
What disappoints with Robertson is he had 4 uninterrupted years to really develop players and gameplans. Instead there seems a continuing reliance on the old guard with injury being the main engine of change.
4 years? He started Nov 2023 and his first game was in 2024?
I used the simple past tense. You seem to have read it as the present perfect tense.
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@Victor-Meldrew said in Scotland v All Blacks:
What disappoints with Robertson is he had 4 uninterrupted years to really develop players and gameplans. Instead there seems a continuing reliance on the old guard with injury being the main engine of change.
4 years? He started Nov 2023 and his first game was in 2024?
I used the simple past tense. You seem to have read it as the present perfect tense.
Oh you mean he has 4 years before the RWC but you're judging him now before son of Surf Jesus rises from the waves of Japan? Ok then.
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@Victor-Meldrew said in Scotland v All Blacks:
@nostrildamus said in Scotland v All Blacks:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Scotland v All Blacks:
What disappoints with Robertson is he had 4 uninterrupted years to really develop players and gameplans. Instead there seems a continuing reliance on the old guard with injury being the main engine of change.
4 years? He started Nov 2023 and his first game was in 2024?
I used the simple past tense. You seem to have read it as the present perfect tense.
And correct use of the split infinitive, to boot!
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@nostrildamus said in Scotland v All Blacks:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Scotland v All Blacks:
What disappoints with Robertson is he had 4 uninterrupted years to really develop players and gameplans. Instead there seems a continuing reliance on the old guard with injury being the main engine of change.
4 years? He started Nov 2023 and his first game was in 2024?
I used the simple past tense. You seem to have read it as the present perfect tense.
Oh you mean he has 4 years before the RWC but you're judging him now before son of Surf Jesus rises from the waves of Japan? Ok then.
"had"
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@Victor-Meldrew said in Scotland v All Blacks:
@nostrildamus said in Scotland v All Blacks:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Scotland v All Blacks:
What disappoints with Robertson is he had 4 uninterrupted years to really develop players and gameplans. Instead there seems a continuing reliance on the old guard with injury being the main engine of change.
4 years? He started Nov 2023 and his first game was in 2024?
I used the simple past tense. You seem to have read it as the present perfect tense.
Oh you mean he has 4 years before the RWC but you're judging him now before son of Surf Jesus rises from the waves of Japan? Ok then.
"had"
no I think that is confusing. Yes he would have had 4 years when he started (or perhaps even less than that) but to say had now implies it is all gone. There are still 2 years left.
But stick the boot in now while you can. It is easier to complain than suggest solutions. -
@nostrildamus said in Scotland v All Blacks:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Scotland v All Blacks:
@nostrildamus said in Scotland v All Blacks:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Scotland v All Blacks:
What disappoints with Robertson is he had 4 uninterrupted years to really develop players and gameplans. Instead there seems a continuing reliance on the old guard with injury being the main engine of change.
4 years? He started Nov 2023 and his first game was in 2024?
I used the simple past tense. You seem to have read it as the present perfect tense.
Oh you mean he has 4 years before the RWC but you're judging him now before son of Surf Jesus rises from the waves of Japan? Ok then.
"had"
no I think that is confusing. Yes he would have had 4 years when he started (or perhaps even less than that) but to say had now implies it is all gone. There are still 2 years left.
But stick the boot in now while you can. It is easier to complain than suggest solutions.Auxiliary verb used conditionally and therefore incorrectly. Still "had"........
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@nonpartizan said in Scotland v All Blacks:
@DurryMexted said in Scotland v All Blacks:
@sparky said in Scotland v All Blacks:
How many bad games can Ardie Savea and Beauden Barrett keep having in Black?
I can't remember any of our players in the past escaping scrutiny for such consistently disappointing performances.
Thats the issue - there is a cognitive dissonance across the whole of NZ (& world) rugby media and consumers - people genuinely watch these guys play and their branding just over rides any actual critical thought about how these guys should be playing
So true.
Non NZ rugby media in particular give effusive praise to them both based mostly on reputation.
It's weird how in some quarters, actual form is a complete irrelevance when judging players. It's all vibes and highlights from years ago. Ardie was absolutely superb in Super rugby but he's not had a great test season but given his profile and PR he will never face all that much scrutiny.
I'm not even hating, it's just funny how in a professional workplace you can get away with so much based on your work performance a long time ago.
I think it strange, we all rightfully have opinions on most players, but if writers in the media have them different to us, we dismiss them, and suggest it's vibes and reputation. I make no secret ,I would at this stage pick BB (just) and certainly would Ardie. I admit I would like perhaps Ardie as captain, and perhaps wonder if we are better off with Scooter being dropped. Just my opinion of course, but if all were fit, I think my starting locks would be Holland and Vai'i with PT on bench, and Lord being in squad etc. But I also admit I know no more than anyone else , and just look at what I would want in my players.
